Bettie: Another Advantage Gambler Article

[Bettie]

Apparently, the article on advantage gambling in the R-J on Sunday has created some real interest here among officials. Below is a link for more on the story.

Bettie

Officials Request Guidance

[DD']

He is asking for guidence when it should be obvious. They have an obligation to protect both parties according to the rules of the law. What would happen if we had our own security guards drag a pit boss out to the parking lot, search him, and lock him in a car while we questioned him. I don't think he'd be asking for any guidence in the situation. Uphold the law. How is that for guidence. This agent is trying to sympathize with the casino rather than being a neutral and impartial third party with the job of protecting the rights of all involved. He thinks it is their job to help casinos rid themselves of advantage players and he wants to know how far they can go in helping the casinos in this endeavor.

[Norm Wattenberger]

Well, at least it's nice to know that he thinks the FIRST response to a perfectly legal activity shouldn't result in handcuffs. But, I guess if you insist on conducting legal activity twice, then handcuffs are OK.

[DD']

Here's how the casino would interpret that: Our first response is not handcuffs. First we will politely ask the patron to surrender all chips and surrender ID. Handcuffs will be the next option when they refuse.

[suicyco maniac]

>"They're abusing a system that is set up to reward people for their play" What the hell are they talking about. The "system" is set up to allow stupid people to blow their entire life savings. Am I mistaken here?? SM

[Norm Wattenberger]

First, the notion that this problem is limited to Vegas and casinos and not a more general problem should be dispelled. I have read a few stories on department store security guards beating ?undesirables.? They nearly always get away with it. Victims are primarily blacks and there have been deaths. Although the stories I've seen occurred primarily in the South, there was also a disturbing report on Macy's in NYC just last month. They have a room with shackles along one wall. Suspected shoplifters are brought to the room, shackled to the wall and left alone to ponder their fate. After a time, they are told that they have a choice. Either be turned over to the police for prosecution leaving them with a criminal record that prevents them from future employment. Or, paying triple the price for whatever they are accused of stealing. The question is, how many innocent people after being shackled to a wall by private guards would gladly pay the extortion just to escape.

In my opinion, the way to fight the abuses in Vegas is to put it in the larger context of nationwide violations of civil rights by private establishments. Few people pity the poor gambler and consider casinos as a no man?s land. But, if they see that Macy?s does not stand just for warm and fuzzies like the Thanksgiving Day parade, July 4th fireworks and a movie about Santa Clause; but has a hidden room where your children can be stripped of their rights, dignity and feelings of security; they might see the problem more clearly. And if it is legal for Macy?s, then isn?t it legal for the kid at the corner seven-eleven who thinks you took too much from the slurpy machine to tie you up in the basement?

[Knight of Dawn]

Do you have any links to these articles?
Cheers!
KOD

> First, the notion that this problem is
> limited to Vegas and casinos and not a more
> general problem should be dispelled. I have
> read a few stories on department store
> security guards beating ?undesirables.? They
> nearly always get away with it. Victims are
> primarily blacks and there have been deaths.
> Although the stories I've seen occurred
> primarily in the South, there was also a
> disturbing report on Macy's in NYC just last
> month. They have a room with shackles along
> one wall. Suspected shoplifters are brought
> to the room, shackled to the wall and left
> alone to ponder their fate. After a time,
> they are told that they have a choice.
> Either be turned over to the police for
> prosecution leaving them with a criminal
> record that prevents them from future
> employment. Or, paying triple the price for
> whatever they are accused of stealing. The
> question is, how many innocent people after
> being shackled to a wall by private guards
> would gladly pay the extortion just to
> escape.

> In my opinion, the way to fight the abuses
> in Vegas is to put it in the larger context
> of nationwide violations of civil rights by
> private establishments. Few people pity the
> poor gambler and consider casinos as a no
> man?s land. But, if they see that Macy?s
> does not stand just for warm and fuzzies
> like the Thanksgiving Day parade, July 4th
> fireworks and a movie about Santa Clause;
> but has a hidden room where your children
> can be stripped of their rights, dignity and
> feelings of security; they might see the
> problem more clearly. And if it is legal for
> Macy?s, then isn?t it legal for the kid at
> the corner seven-eleven who thinks you took
> too much from the slurpy machine to tie you
> up in the basement?

[Norm Wattenberger]

> Do you have any links to these articles?
> Cheers!
> KOD

Didn't see them on the web. Try the NYTimes website for the Macy's article. It was in the Times; I think about a month ago. The other stories appear now and again over the years and I have no web links. Also 60 minutes ran a story on department store beatings. There have been several suits - but I haven't a clue how to look them up.

[Bearer]

I laughed out loud when I read that line. What do you expect from someone in PR? Try to get other players to believe that advantage players are taking advantage of _them_. Yeah, that's the ticket!

Being a tad more charitable, though, it may be that this statement was taken out of context and was made in relation to comps. The statement then applies both to advantage players and comp hustlers (er, sorry Max, that's "comp counters").

[ET Fan]