What makes a true AP?

[Villiam]

Jeeez
I think Zeebar is charming and relatively polite here. He used jest for once and ya'll tore his head off. I think he has a relatively interesting point and I myself am curious how much the "famous" in this community can/do play. That said, they are obviously built for kickin ass and killin it so to suggest that they are doing bad by their families or something is silly. For others, maybe inclusive of Zees frustration, this is not a pursuit they should think they could take on. I'm still not sure if I should be or not. If that's the issue for old Zee, then for god's sake let him talk about it. Our goal is to help each other become better players on our own time.

As for massacring threads, what if moderators stopped allowing posts that are clear derails so we could keep things on topic instead of closing threads down when they get petty? Just an idea.

[Three]

Zee has made it clear over the years he has a gambling problem. I think he will at least halfway admit it. I know a lot of people with the same issue. That should be true about almost everyone here given the circles we run in. He moved to were the temptation was no longer easily accessible which may allow him to have the discipline to become an AP. He will go on much less frequent trips to hopefully better gaming destinations. If he is disciplined enough to seek to maximize the quality of his play rather than the quantity he should become profitable over expenses.

[BoSox]

Jeeez
I think Zeebar is charming and relatively polite here. He used jest for once and ya'll tore his head off. I think he has a relatively interesting point and I myself am curious how much the "famous" in this community can/do play.

If Zee just spoke his peace, there would have been criticizing , but far, far less if he just had the balls to say it himself, rather than the runaround friend of his.

If that's the issue for old Zee, then for god's sake let him talk about it. Our goal is to help each other become better players on our own time.

Absolutely, when will he start doing this?

[ZeeBabar]

Zee has made it clear over the years he has a gambling problem. I think he will at least halfway admit it. I know a lot of people with the same issue. That should be true about almost everyone here given the circles we run in. He moved to were the temptation was no longer easily accessible which may allow him to have the discipline to become an AP. He will go on much less frequent trips to hopefully better gaming destinations. If he is disciplined enough to seek to maximize the quality of his play rather than the quantity he should become profitable over expenses.

you are so correct. The move was to control the daily temptation to be at the table instead of friends and family. Now, I have to make trips. The problem still is that on the trip, as I complete the 4-5 hour drive (Tunica or St. Louis etc.), I make a plan of attack, that is, check in, rest/nap for a couple of hours, head to the game, play a couple of hours, rest, etc. However, soon as I land, I abandon the plan, throw my bag in my room, down at the table. Get tired, return to room but not get sufficient rest/sleep before I am playing again. I get progressively tired and the drive home is a bitch.

I am hoping that I keep working on controlling myself during the trips. First 2 day trip, landed and played, won $900 in the first 5-6 hours, could not sleep, returned and lost my winnings, broke even on trip. Second two day trip, won, lost, rested a couple of hours, went back down and won some more and then had the good sense to realize that if I sat and played tired, I would again lose and the drive would be tough so I just up and drove back. Won about $350. If I factor in the $350 over two trip expenses, I broke even.

Interestingly, when I lived near a casino. While I played daily, playing for 1-2 hours was enough for me and over 2 years, won about $20k.

[Norm]

I have to say a couple things in Z's favor. He admits to having problems (and we all have problems). Also, he doesn't let abuse bother him. And, he has taken a huge amount of abuse elsewhere. Indeed, the fact he seems immune to abuse appears to drive some people nuts.

[Freightman]

I have to say a couple things in Z's favor. He admits to having problems (and we all have problems). Also, he doesn't let abuse bother him. And, he has taken a huge amount of abuse elsewhere. Indeed, the fact he seems immune to abuse appears to drive some people nuts.

Like I said, nothing drove activity like a Zee bashing thread. Like I also said, Zee stood up for himself - much to his credit.
At one time it was a wham bash, or an Electric Kid bash, or even a Flash bash. Bashing was a cultural.

[Ryemo]

Like I said, nothing drove activity like a Zee bashing thread. Like I also said, Zee stood up for himself - much to his credit.
At one time it was a wham bash, or an Electric Kid bash, or even a Flash bash. Bashing was a cultural.

I've researched some older threads on BJ21 and I know Wham used to get some flack back in the day. I've actually had the opportunity to meet him a few times. Super nice guy! He's got a very expressive personality and he's very fun to talk with.

[ZeeBabar]

Bashing on BJ forums is particularly nasty because someone or other has had a losing or frustration session or were backed off someplace. All that hostility needs to come out and a somewhat old man who is perhaps a slow or lazy learner is there to bash. I understand it. It says more about the person doing the bashing than it does me. Someone in control, Norm or Don S or a few others, simply either do not read my posts or delete it. Others seem unable to go on and take the time to knock me about. If they cannot have the discipline to simply delete, ignore or go on to another thread, I cannot see how they could be great AP's. They may be winning AP's but they are also either addicted to the forum or the game.

[Freightman]

I've researched some older threads on BJ21 and I know Wham used to get some flack back in the day. I've actually had the opportunity to meet him a few times. Super nice guy! He's got a very expressive personality and he's very fun to talk with.

If you're still a member at bj21, have a peek at his beginning posts. If my recollections are accurate (and I'm not saying that they are) he was being absolutely ripped to shreds. Would make the worst if the Zee bashing look like a walk in the park. All has been well now.

IVe also met him. He's a good ole boy. Pretty good sense of humour.

[Norm]

Well, in addition to a thread titled: "What makes an AP," perhaps we should have a thread: "What makes a basher." Then we can list all the embarrassing psychological inadequacies on the main page.

[Bigdaddy]

I've researched some older threads on BJ21 and I know Wham used to get some flack back in the day. I've actually had the opportunity to meet him a few times. Super nice guy! He's got a very expressive personality and he's very fun to talk with.

Yes - Wham is now the master of laconic posts on the BJ21 site. Good guy - he's also helped me with some recommended spots in LV.

[Three]

Interestingly, when I lived near a casino. While I played daily, playing for 1-2 hours was enough for me and over 2 years, won about $20k.

Zee, I have some advice for you. Only play well rested. Try to focus on being at the top of your game and only playing the best conditions you can find on the trip. After a while you will get used to the rhythms of the casino and the customers. The tables may be quite empty at certain times due to lack of players or at other times due to changing the cards or opening more tables. People tend to eat and rise from bed at similar times. You will be able to figure I can get in a round 2 hours here and 3 hours there and rove to find scattered opportunities of an hour or so then. Then you will find times when you are wasting your time looking for a good game.

Once you get used to the rhythms of the different days of the week you will be in the right place at the right time. You will know several times during the day you can get the best conditions and plan to eat and rest when conditions are less appealing. You will find you can make more money with a higher degree of certainty while playing about 75% of the amount of time or less of what you do now. Winning isn't about the quantity of your play it is about the quality of your betting and playing decisions and the quality of the game you are playing, the game speed, how many rounds you get in a high advantage situation, and the percentage of good cards you expect to get when the cards you are betting in anticipation of hit. As the table gets more players you want to play more spots or just leave the table at the next disadvantage situation. When conditions tank you should look for better conditions at your earliest opportunity to wave goodbye to a disadvantage situation. You need to eat sleep and get breaks to stay sharp. By optimizing the times you play and getting your other needs taken care of when things are suboptimal you will find it easiest to make a predictable profit.

Often people get obsessed with getting time in to get to their n0 fastest but the truth is you have a different n0 for the varying table conditions. By only playing the best conditions you approach n0 much faster while making more money than if you just try to get lots of time in regardless of conditions. This is because the SCORE tanked when the table crowded up and the game speed suffered greatly. N0 is the inverse of SCORE (N0 = 1,000,000/SCORE). So you need a lot more rounds to reach n0 at a crowded table but game speed tanks so you get in far fewer rounds/hour. You will find this to be a very important step to becoming a predictably successful AP. Their are lots of ways to control variance which besides the obvious affect on predictability also affects almost all the important stats for your play like SCORE/N0 and CE. CE is affected more than SCORE/N0 since it is proportional to the inverse square of variance (variance squared is in the denominator of the fraction).

[Freightman]

Zee, I have some advice for you. Only play well rested. Try to focus on being at the top of your game and only playing the best conditions you can find on the trip. After a while you will get used to the rhythms of the casino and the customers. The tables may be quite empty at certain times due to lack of players or at other times due to changing the cards or opening more tables. People tend to eat and rise from bed at similar times. You will be able to figure I can get in a round 2 hours here and 3 hours there and rove to find scattered opportunities of an hour or so then. Then you will find times when you are wasting your time looking for a good game.

Once you get used to the rhythms of the different days of the week you will be in the right place at the right time. You will know several times during the day you can get the best conditions and plan to eat and rest when conditions are less appealing. You will find you can make more money with a higher degree of certainty while playing about 75% of the amount of time or less of what you do now. Winning isn't about the quantity of your play it is about the quality of your betting and playing decisions and the quality of the game you are playing, the game speed, how many rounds you get in a high advantage situation, and the percentage of good cards you expect to get when the cards you are betting in anticipation of hit. As the table gets more players you want to play more spots or just leave the table at the next disadvantage situation. When conditions tank you should look for better conditions at your earliest opportunity to wave goodbye to a disadvantage situation. You need to eat sleep and get breaks to stay sharp. By optimizing the times you play and getting your other needs taken care of when things are suboptimal you will find it easiest to make a predictable profit.

Often people get obsessed with getting time in to get to their n0 fastest but the truth is you have a different n0 for the varying table conditions. By only playing the best conditions you approach n0 much faster while making more money than if you just try to get lots of time in regardless of conditions. This is because the SCORE tanked when the table crowded up and the game speed suffered greatly. N0 is the inverse of SCORE (N0 = 1,000,000/SCORE). So you need a lot more rounds to reach n0 at a crowded table but game speed tanks so you get in far fewer rounds/hour. You will find this to be a very important step to becoming a predictably successful AP. Their are lots of ways to control variance which besides the obvious affect on predictability also affects almost all the important stats for your play like SCORE/N0 and CE. CE is affected more than SCORE/N0 since it is proportional to the inverse square of variance (variance squared is in the denominator of the fraction).

T3 lists some very good valid statistical points. You also have to pay attention to your own body clock. Conditions may be perfect at graveyard, but if it screws up your body rhythm, it could cost you more than you gain. Again, you need to weigh both sides of the equation.

Also, read T3's first 2 sentences - very important. I've paid the price when I ignored my own advice.