cheating dealer

[Aslan]

There's no doubt about the possibility, but the probability is very low for, like I stated before large corporation owned casinos such as Harrah's, MGM, Sands etc. the probability is very miniscule. I would be more concerned about casinos that have already been busted for cheating. Soaring Eagle in Michigan got caught more than once for taking aces out of blackjack decks. Places like that would be a major concern to me and I would avoid them. However, I don't deal pitch games and I know little about the procedures so I can imagine it would be easier to slip a mechanic in there than in the shoe games. If I get one of my shoes back in the near future I will try to remember to upload a video of the move so that you can see what it looks like to be aware of such unscrupulous activity.

The reason I mention this is because I had the experience at one of CET's properties on the Vegas strip that appeared just like that. My dealer in a pitch game was bobbing and weaving, constantly chattering, moving his deck hand all over the place, sometimes into positions where he could easily glimpse the next card (you know the trick, propping the top card up on your palm so that you can glimpse the corner index), holding the deck in a classic mechanic's grip, and hitting hands in ways I think it would be possible to throw out seconds. I never saw any cheat, and maybe he was just mimicking the mannerisms of a cheat, but I made a point of excessively scrutinizing his every move as a signal to him that if he was doing something, he'd better think twice. This has never happened since, but it did happen that night. I was ahead and stayed ahead and left $500 up, but I should have left the moment I suspected anything. It was one of my first outings as a card counter and I never returned to that game after zengrifter advised me it was a poor game rules-wise. My point is, it is possible that a particular pit could act outside their authority to enhance their numbers and gain favor with the company. The company itself would have to be stone crazy to condone such behavior. If I were in management, I would not even allow a dealer to exhibit the mannerisms of this particular dealer, because it had to make a lot of people like myself uneasy about playing there. Bobbing and weaving and "slick" movements does not belong in the repertoire of a casino dealer.

[steveistheman84]

you guys come to reno and you'll be blown away. about 50% of the places i play blackjack have cheating dealers. it sucks when i play a dealer i don't recognize because i have to watch them closely. the casinos with the most cheaters is the circus circus and the eldorado. any handheld game with a dealer who's asian or male- stay away! half of the time i will see 3 crowded tables and then an empty sd table with some 50 asian lady dealer standing there. i just walk on by.

[DiceDealer]

That's a really interesting story Aslan. I know many dealers who act "slick" with bob and weave movements but they all deal craps! It is in our job description when dealing BJ to "walk your game" (move across the table to where you are dealing watching the opposite base) but this doesn't generate slick or questionable movements. I don't like dealers who try to act slick either, they move too fast and are prone to making mistakes. Slow, smooth and deliberate movements look better and are far more effective to accurate dealing procedures.

@steve - I've never been to Reno and I don't think I want to go now lol! Thanks for the heads up.

[WRX]

you guys come to reno and you'll be blown away. about 50% of the places i play blackjack have cheating dealers. it sucks when i play a dealer i don't recognize because i have to watch them closely. the casinos with the most cheaters is the circus circus and the eldorado. any handheld game with a dealer who's asian or male- stay away! half of the time i will see 3 crowded tables and then an empty sd table with some 50 asian lady dealer standing there. i just walk on by.

I've played a LOT in Reno for the past six years or more, and that hasn't been my experience. Circus Circus has been known to swap in a preferential-shuffling dealer. That's pretty well known. I'll leave it at that.

[zengrifter]

User is banned, content deleted.

[steveistheman84]

That's a really interesting story Aslan. I know many dealers who act "slick" with bob and weave movements but they all deal craps! It is in our job description when dealing BJ to "walk your game" (move across the table to where you are dealing watching the opposite base) but this doesn't generate slick or questionable movements. I don't like dealers who try to act slick either, they move too fast and are prone to making mistakes. Slow, smooth and deliberate movements look better and are far more effective to accurate dealing procedures.

@steve - I've never been to Reno and I don't think I want to go now lol! Thanks for the heads up.

don't let the story scare you too much. reno's still a great place to play. you just have to be a little more selective with handheld games.

[Ouchez]

I can execute that move but I don't deal pitch games. I just thought I would let you guys know what to look for in shoe games if you think that the house is up to no good. I know that large corporate owned McCasino's wouldn't do that since they don't need too, but some secluded places in the middle of nowhere may have some less than desirable practices.

Dice,

I doubt you have ever dealt pitch in Detroit unless the 6.5 sd. Pitch is a rarity in Detroit, the last one was at G-Town,,correct me if I am wrong.

Thanks,
Ouchez

[steveistheman84]

Losing is making you paranoid.

it's better than not suspecting anything and thinking you're generating positive ev while doing the opposite.

[DiceDealer]

Pitch is all gone in Detroit. I think you are right. Greektown had it but they took it out too. They have a shoe game outside by the craps tables that is easy to back count (Stand next to base, min bet the don't or something.) but they have a NMSE if you want to bet more than $100 aggregate wager. So it would seem to me that they would tolerate a little counting or it's a trap.

[dharmaprija]

I got a FEMALE dealer the other day, young, blonde, ditzy acting, actually kind of "threw" a card across the table out of the shoe, it slipped and bounced. I was in a FANTASTIC +12-15 RC near the cut card and got hit with nothing but 16's and couldnt even win with a 20. Can anyone tell me the "tell tale signs" if this little scab was DD me???? I just cant get around that the deck should have been HOT HOT and was given me crap. I was at third base, wish It was second but it was just hand after hand and in all truth it STARTED after the Pit Boss came by the table and the other guys at the table asked "whos that?" the dealer said "oh thats my boss". Do you think the PB gave the kid a signal to F*** me? IRONICALLY this was the only time the whole night I bet more than $7 or $8 a hand???? I was betting $20. I am trying to get a copy of the video from a friend who works surv.

[Aslan]

I got a FEMALE dealer the other day, young, blonde, ditzy acting, actually kind of "threw" a card across the table out of the shoe, it slipped and bounced. I was in a FANTASTIC +12-15 RC near the cut card and got hit with nothing but 16's and couldnt even win with a 20. Can anyone tell me the "tell tale signs" if this little scab was DD me???? I just cant get around that the deck should have been HOT HOT and was given me crap. I was at third base, wish It was second but it was just hand after hand and in all truth it STARTED after the Pit Boss came by the table and the other guys at the table asked "whos that?" the dealer said "oh thats my boss". Do you think the PB gave the kid a signal to F*** me? IRONICALLY this was the only time the whole night I bet more than $7 or $8 a hand???? I was betting $20. I am trying to get a copy of the video from a friend who works surv.

You'll find eventually that it's just one of the things you will go through from time to time. Everything looks like it just could not happen by chance-- but it can, and it does. I don't know how many times I have played in a high plus count, say, around +12 and the strangest things happen. For example, you split nines against a dealer upcard 5. You may even have a double down from one of them, and probably hit it with a 3. Then the dealer turns a 5 hole card. Oh, sh#t! But then you sigh a little sigh of relief as he turns a 6. Whewww! But, alas, his last card is another 5. Gasp! Choke! Arrgh!

This past summer I was having one of those days when nothing worked out. "This can't be happening," I said to myself. "It's gotta change!" Finally, the count was +6 I think and I pushed out a very large bet. I still remember that I got two black Queens, one a spade and the other a club. I was third base I think. First base caught a natural. I thought to myself, "Good, that helps to seal it." NOT. The dealer turns a blackjack.

I don't know how many times I'd have sworn they had to be cheating, but I know they're not. Sometimes these dealers are so lame, they couldn't cheat with a gaffed shoe. It just happens. Grin and bear it. Of course the ones like you had that look like they could be "skilled" are the hardest to get over. But 999 times out of 1000, it is just bad luck.

OTOH, I've won so many hands in a negative count that if I didn't know better, I'd think I was cheating! I wonder what the dealer thought? Things happen.

[Kat]

yeah man, i should have been more alert. i try to usually avoid male dealers, but i wasn't even concerned this time, and he fit all the criteria. male, middle-aged and had glasses.

Well, there's the problem right there... From now on I'm definitely avoiding all male, middle-aged men wearing glasses. Problem solved.

[DiceDealer]

Losing is making you paranoid.

This quote here. Mathematically improbably things can happen at the tables, that doesn't indicate foul play.