Bart: Vegas Trip Report, Table Conditions

[Bart]

I played in Vegas last weekend. Here is what I found:

Stardust: 2 deck, das, $25 minimum; 2 deck H17, das, $10-15 min. Penetration about 50%. 1-8 spread ($25-200) tolerated with no heat; no mid-shoe entry signs on 2 deck games;

Barbary Coast: 2 deck, das, $10 min; 50% penetration, 1-8 spread ($25-200) tolerated with no heat;

Circus: 1 deck (2 tables) H17, das, D10-11, $10 minimum, no mid-shoe entry signs, penetration 60%, 1-10 spread tolerated ($10-100);

Frontier: 6 deck, H17, das, ls, $5 minimum, 1 and 1/2 to 2 decks cut off; 2 deck, H17, das, $25 min.

Westward Ho: 6 deck, H17, no das;

Mirage: typical: 2 deck, das, $50 min;

Flamingo: much 1 deck, bj pays 6/5;

Horseshoe, Golden Nugget, Four Queens: 2 deck, H17 and no das;

Trends that I saw: more H17, more no mid-shoe entry signs on 1 and 2 deck games, 50% pen. in 2 deck games, more 6 deck games (especially at Circus which used to have many 1 deck games), many shuffle machines, downtown is 2 deck, H17, no das, and 6/5 bj.

Is the end near?

[Don Schlesinger]

> Is the end near?

If you keep playing in unspeakable dumps (with one or two exceptions)? Yes, definitely.

Don

[Drew]

> Barbary Coast: 2 deck, das, $10 min; 50%
> penetration, 1-8 spread ($25-200) tolerated
> with no heat;

Hmm... I was backed off at this place for a single jump from $10 to $25. I'd be surprised if 1-8 in green is tolerated very long at this dump. Why would you even play here (or half of the other places on your list), anyway?
-=-Drew

[Parker]

First off, this really belongs on the "Las Vegas Everything" page. That is the place for Vegas trip reports, and anything regarding Las Vegas, both blackjack and non-blackjack related.

> Barbary Coast: 2 deck, das, $10 min; 50%
> penetration, 1-8 spread ($25-200) tolerated
> with no heat;

You must not have played more than about 10 minutes. I got the boot there the second time I went to a max bet.

> Trends that I saw: more H17, more no
> mid-shoe entry signs on 1 and 2 deck games,
> 50% pen. in 2 deck games, more 6 deck games
> (especially at Circus which used to have
> many 1 deck games), many shuffle machines,
> downtown is 2 deck, H17, no das, and 6/5 bj.

> Is the end near?

Not at all. I consider "no mid-entry" on single and double deck games to be a Good Thing. It is harder to find decent pen on DD games, but it is there if you look hard.

The only reason to go downtown is to play single deck. There are lots of single deck tables at the Horseshoe, Las Vegas Club and El Cortez, and a couple of tables each at the Golden Gate, Four Queens, and Lady Luck. I am unaware of any 6:5 games downtown.

There are actually fewer CSM's in Las Vegas than there were a year ago.

Playable double deck can be found at many of the locals casinos (Stations, Fiestas, AZ Charlies, etc.). Again, it may be necessary to check out several dealers in order to find acceptable penetration.

Nobody said it was easy.

[98%]

Ultimately, the place where you play does not matter very much if your bit bet is no more than low black, though I would give the Barbary Coast (or any Coast property for that matter) a miss in the future. You can find favorable conditions in nearly any casino in Las Vegas but, at the same time, you can find abyssmal conditions in the very same casino. In other words, you have to scope out all the games - shoes, SD, DD - and find the dealers who give the best penetration. (On a side note, I'm always amazed when I see a counter sitting at a DD game with 50% when the next table over has a shoe with 80% penetration, better rules and more hands per hour). You will find large differences in penetration from dealer to dealer or perhaps shift to shift, especially on double decks, at most casinos which offer them. If the average penetration at a casino is around 50% on the double decks then, chances are, you can find at least one dealer giving 70% or better. My suggestion for a person planning a typical 3 to 7 day trip to Las Vegas is to first decide which casinos you intend to play and then spend at least a couple of hours on every shift on your first day just scouting conditions to find the best games, dealers and weakest pits and formulating a plan of attack based on this information.