Hi
A lot of joints have gone to the Shufflemaster "King" machines. I have always assumed that because the machines keep reloading the cards there's nothing that can be done. A pit manager told me that Shufflemaster admitted the machines could be beat when they installed them at her casino. Has anyone ever heard of this? Anywhere I can find out more?
Diaconis wrote about them recently. You can see the article at
http://www.discover.com/current_issue/index.html
> Hi
> A lot of joints have gone to the
> Shufflemaster "King" machines. I
> have always assumed that because the
> machines keep reloading the cards there's
> nothing that can be done. A pit manager told
> me that Shufflemaster admitted the machines
> could be beat when they installed them at
> her casino. Has anyone ever heard of this?
> Anywhere I can find out more?
Yes, and I'm sure she told you that their Keno game was very vulnerable, too. So, please sir, whatever you do, please don't go over there and bet a lot of money. The King is not beatable. Blackjack is popular because it is beatable, even though very few have the skill and bankroll to do it. Your friendly pit manager wants it both ways. She wants to offer an unbeatable game but have people think it's beatable. That's why the King is actually probably a bigger threat to the casino bottom line than for the player. If they let the King destroy the mystique that blackjack is a beatable game, they lose their most profitable table game. As for what Shufflemaster says about the King: It offered $100,000 to anyone who could beat the King.
> Hi
> A lot of joints have gone to the
> Shufflemaster "King" machines. I
> have always assumed that because the
> machines keep reloading the cards there's
> nothing that can be done. A pit manager told
> me that Shufflemaster admitted the machines
> could be beat when they installed them at
> her casino. Has anyone ever heard of this?
> Anywhere I can find out more?
Various methods have been employed successfully against the machines at one time or another.
Some teams discovered a degree of latency in the card redistribution and played the machines as if they were normal hand-shuffled blackjack dealt down to a constant point of deep penetration. Some individuals have discovered an exploitable degree of nonrandomness in the shuffle. Some used traditional methods such as warping or card steering to take advantage of special vulnerabilities in these devices. Others developed a means of controlling the degree of latency, observing the relationship between card redistribution and hand frequency. And some simply observed that the dealer would occassionally forget to put the cards back in the machine round after round, and bet big when a clump of small cards was discarded.
You can read about some of this in my "Get The Edge At Blackjack" but mostly those that know won't discuss it.
Sure, some ploppies beat the "king" as well as beat the craps tables and the super funny tables.
Can you win in the long run?....NO
With lots of luck,the best you can do against the CSM is maybe break even...besides why consider playing a game that ploppies even hate.
A black box where NO PLAYER can see what's happening(another form of latency) and is denied cutting the cards is the main reason why continuous shuffle machines have failed at the casinos. There is never a fantasy "HOT" shoe that ploppies can take action against.
Is this a good enough post to pass the audition?
JAC
"It offered $100,000 to anyone who could beat the King."
If someone was smart enough to beat it, there is a good chance they also had enough brains to know that the "formula" would be worth alot more on the street than $100,000.
> Yes, and I'm sure she told you that their
> Keno game was very vulnerable, too. So,
> please sir, whatever you do, please don't go
> over there and bet a lot of money. The King
> is not beatable. Blackjack is popular
> because it is beatable, even though very few
> have the skill and bankroll to do it. Your
> friendly pit manager wants it both ways. She
> wants to offer an unbeatable game but have
> people think it's beatable.
You may not be able to beat King, but do not confuse your intuition and/or instinct with the truth. Do some research.
That's why the
> King is actually probably a bigger threat to
> the casino bottom line than for the player.
> If they let the King destroy the mystique
> that blackjack is a beatable game, they lose
> their most profitable table game. As for
> what Shufflemaster says about the King: It
> offered $100,000 to anyone who could beat
> the King.
Did you try and contact them? They were very difficult to get hold of. After several hours of persistent phone calls I managed to get enough out of them to determine that they would not pay up under any circumstances whatsoever, including a public demonstration whereby I would play unmolested against the device and win some fixed amount of money with a fixed bankroll. The offer was a cheap publicity stunt.
Now, as I understand it, Shufflemaster have recently revised their claims of indestructability under legal advice since they face potentially unlimited losses if their devices are in fact beaten, at least according to one nervous pit boss I played against recently.
I keep hearing all the moaning about CSMs but in Vegas I see very few of them. Yes, the MGM/Mirage joints have them but other than that they are pretty scarce.
> Hi
> A lot of joints have gone to the
> Shufflemaster "King" machines. I
> have always assumed that because the
> machines keep reloading the cards there's
> nothing that can be done. A pit manager told
> me that Shufflemaster admitted the machines
> could be beat when they installed them at
> her casino. Has anyone ever heard of this?
> Anywhere I can find out more?
What means "machine keeps reloading the cards"??
What is the difference to other CSMs??
The article is interesting but I think the link you provided may be outdated. Try the one at the bottom of this post.
Buick
> I keep hearing all the moaning about CSMs
> but in Vegas I see very few of them. Yes,
> the MGM/Mirage joints have them but other
> than that they are pretty scarce.
1. Ploppies don't play them
2. Dealers hate them.
3. Bosses annoyed since they often break down and hence maintenace costs.
That's why they are scarce these days.
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