P'Boy: Better BJ player

[P'Boy]

Which would make more money?Imagine both playing at the same game.A guy who has an amazing act and looks like a crazy gambler who never shuts up and has lots of superstitions,but who doesnt follow optimal betting or indices too much but gets a good spread.(ie higher bets out at higher counts)Or a guy who follows optimal betting closely and indices better uses a higher count but cant get a better spread.
In other words which is better a good act or playing by the book?

[Pro21]

In other words which is better a good act or
playing by the book?

Permit me to change your question... If you have a choice between one player who knows all his index numbers from -20 to +20 and never makes a mistake and spreads from say 1-10

Player 2 only knows perfect basic strategy and 2 index numbers -- 16 vs. 10 and insurance but he spreads 1 - 15 player 2 will make much more money.

Now I am saying this without running any simulations but the bottom line is this - strategy variations are worth very little in multi-deck games and any chance to get a little more money on the table will earn you more.

[Don Schlesinger]

> Now I am saying this without running any
> simulations but the bottom line is this -
> strategy variations are worth very little in
> multi-deck games and any chance to get a
> little more money on the table will earn you
> more.

The question also mentioned not betting optimally. It's child's play for me to earn more money than the guy who "plays by the book" -- just bet almost twice as much!

Now let's talk about risk of ruin! :-)

Don

[P'Boy]

> The question also mentioned not betting
> optimally. It's child's play for me to earn
> more money than the guy who "plays by
> the book" -- just bet almost twice as
> much!

> Now let's talk about risk of ruin! :-)

> Don

Ok lets say the guy with the great act has a ROR of 20%

[SOTSOG]

> Ok lets say the guy with the great act has a
> ROR of 20%

Playing with a ROR of 20% for any length of time,
the guy with the great act would be a poor boy, indeed.

[Pro21]

> Now let's talk about risk of ruin! :-)

Player 1 plays at a $15 minimum table and spreads 1-10 up to $150. He bets $25 units but $15 on zero or neg counts.

Player 2 does the same thing on a $10 table so his min is $10 and he has a 1 - 15.

So Player 2 also has a lower ROR.

But I think the original question was which is worth more -- index numbers or bet spread.

[G Man]

The pro who wants to win and survive in this game must be able to do both, have a very good act and know a lot about this game, like knowing some indexes, maybe not a hundred but a least 18-35. How about,talking, having fun, using a good spread "naturally" and knowing your indexes? This is when you`ll know you`ll be good. RoR considerations are done at home before you place any bet.

[Pboy]

> Player 1 plays at a $15 minimum table and
> spreads 1-10 up to $150. He bets $25 units
> but $15 on zero or neg counts.

> Player 2 does the same thing on a $10 table
> so his min is $10 and he has a 1 - 15.

> So Player 2 also has a lower ROR.

> But I think the original question was which
> is worth more -- index numbers or bet
> spread.

I was saying that the first player has a better spread with a better act than opposed to player 2 with all the indices and less spread.
anyway i think my question is redundant as tonight i was playinf and watched a guy who was not a counter but got an amazing spread going.He kept talking and chatting to the dealer,looked like he was enjoying himself no matter what happened,i thought if this guy is a counter is great

[Ray]

> Which would make more money?Imagine both
> playing at the same game.A guy who has an
> amazing act and looks like a crazy gambler
> who never shuts up and has lots of
> superstitions,but who doesnt follow optimal
> betting or indices too much but gets a good
> spread.(ie higher bets out at higher
> counts)Or a guy who follows optimal betting
> closely and indices better uses a higher
> count but cant get a better spread.
> In other words which is better a good act or
> playing by the book?

What I do is play by the book, until I have built up my bankroll. I never liked to play with my own money, only the casino's. Once I have built up my bankroll large enough (which I usually do) by playing it by the book, I then make the big bets when the cards are favorable. I mean if you think you will win that hand, then why do you want to make a small predetermined bet??
I think the guy with the larger bet, with a high count, will out do the guy making small predetermined bets. Simply because the dealer loses more when the count is high. If you don't think thats true, I won $900 last night, starting with $40.

[Parker]

> What I do is play by the book, until I have
> built up my bankroll. I never liked to play
> with my own money, only the casino's. Once I
> have built up my bankroll large enough
> (which I usually do) by playing it by the
> book, I then make the big bets when the
> cards are favorable.

Stop it, you're making my head spin. :-)

First off, you are never ever "playing with the casino's money." Once that money crosses the table it is YOUR money and should be treated accordingly. After all, when you lose, the casinos don't consider the money you lost to be your money and give it back to you, do they?

Casinos love people who think this way.

> I mean if you think you
> will win that hand, then why do you want to
> make a small predetermined bet??

Because you may very well not win that hand. Even if the true count is in double digits, you still only have a relatively small advantage.

Using the old gumball analogy, suppose you were betting on getting a white gumball when blindly reaching into a jar that contained 54 white gumballs and 46 black ones. That's about as good as it gets in card counting.

Would you bet your life on the outcome of a single grab?

> I think the guy with the larger bet, with a
> high count, will out do the guy making small
> predetermined bets. Simply because the
> dealer loses more when the count is high. If
> you don't think thats true, I won $900 last
> night, starting with $40.

As I said in my other reply, you were lucky, not good. The results of a single session mean absolutely nothing.

Anyone who has played the game any length of time has seen many clueless beginners catch a hot streak and parley it into a sizeable chunk of change in a very short time.

We have also seen them give it back just as quickly.

The idea is to play according to a system that gives us a small advantage over the long term, and then play with a relatively small risk of ruin until we put in the hours necessary to reach that long term.