Foxwoods/Mohegan Sun

[DSchles]

Let me explain this a little more. For HiLo counters, your advantage mainly comes from excess numbers of tens and aces. Hilo fits better for S17 games than for h17 because the count tag number -1 is accurate for the ace card in s17 games but not for h17 games. In h17 games, a ace card should be counted as -0.85.

So, you're half right, which is more than usual! If you look at BJA3, p. 522, you'll see the betting effects of removal for games with various combinations of rules. For S17, NDAS, the ace is -.5944 and the ten is -.5081. So, although we're counting both as -1 in Hi-Lo, the ace ought to be counted slightly higher.

For the H17 NDAS game, the ace EOR is -.5311 (less than for the S17, as you mentioned), BUT the ten EOR is now -.5470, MORE than it was for the S17 and virtually identical to the EOR of the ace.

So, if anything, someone might claim that Hi-Lo is BETTER correlated for H17 games because the important tens and aces are both counted identically as -1, which correlates very nicely to their almost identical EORs, whereas for S17, the EORs are about 17% different. And, this suspicion is confirmed in the p. 522 Table D18, below, where the Hi-Lo overall betting correlation for the S17 game is 0.9652 while the BC for the H17 game is 0.9685.

Bottom line: your statement that "Hilo fits better for S17 games than for h17" is just plain wrong.

Don

[DSchles]

You've been here a while and should know everything aceside posts is incorrect.

We can't, of course, just look at the difference in BS values for H17 and S17 and compare to difference for playing against six decks or eight decks. For the counter who spreads his bets sufficiently, the effect of both rules is profound, percentagewise.

It's tricky comparing apples and oranges, and doing so for the importance of these two rules is not so easy, because you're either holding S17 or H17 fixed and then looking at 6 or 8 decks, or you're holding the number of decks fixed and looking at the effect of S17 and H17. All of these depend, naturally, on the penetration, spread, and whether you play-all or back-count.

So, go to pages 214-15 and 232-233 and draw your own conclusions. But, in fairness, they aren't as clear-cut as you may imagine.

Don

[Mr. Ed]

So, I actually went to MGM Springfield. On a Saturday morning, no table games were open until 10:00am. All BJ games were 3:2, but there were continuous shuffle machines at all of the $15 tables. Minimums were $25, and rules were excellent: S17, RSA, ls, 6 decks, DAS. Strangely, the high limit room was closed to table games.

I got super lucky at the $25 table and won over $1000 with zero heat. It was actually a very pleasant experience, and I recommend it to every one - AP players, ploppies, gamblers. I saw one guy betting 7 or 8 black chips at a time - no one gave him any issues, except when he cashed out - they needed 3 guys to verify his cash out.

I am almost ready for a $25 minimum, so when I am, I will frequent this place often.

[aceside]

All BJ games were 3:2, but there were continuous shuffle machines at all of the $15 tables.

Are you sure about this part? In the past, all their CSM were 6:5 blackjack. You finally agreed on me. You need to play 6-decks to have a real edge.

[Mr. Ed]

Yup. There weren’t that many BJ tables. Most of the tables were Spanish 21, War, and other games I could not care less about. The 3 remaining BJ tables were all 3:2, really, I am sure of this.

Like I said, I got lucky this morning. I got like 3 blackjacks, while the guy next to me kept on busting. Yes, the odds were in my favor, but not to the extent that my winnings realized. I just got lucky???????? Oh, I split and doubled both and won all four bets - again, very lucky!!

6 decks helped, but to be honest, my betting was very off and, in hindsight, I ended up under betting on most of the very positive counts.

[aceside]

I’ll make a trip there in a few days. Their rules are superb, so I could beat them with a 1-6 spread. They should have about 20 tables usually.

[21forme]

I could beat them with a 1-6 spread.

How would you know that without simulation software?

[ShipTheCookies]

You need to play 6-decks to have a real edge.

This is just plain false!