CVCX - Confused about a result

**Grobbelaar** · 10-10-2020, 08:43 AM

I made a simulation with CVCX and I don't understand something:

H17, DAS --------> 13.11 (Win per hour) / 5.8 (ROR)

H17, DAS, Sr ----> 12.96 (Win per hour) / 5.4 (ROR)

S17, DAS --------> 19.85 (Win per hour) / 0.8 (ROR)

S17, DAS, Sr ----> 25.09 (Win per hour) / 0.2 (ROR)

What I don't undestand is: With H17 you expect a little less per hour with surrenden than without surrender! (But ROR as expected (only) a bit less)
Why is that?

The Thing is, with S17 it's totally different …. the surrender rule makes a big difference with the expected win per hour.

**Grobbelaar** · 10-10-2020, 08:54 AM

Sorry, it was meant for the Software-Thread

**Norm** · 10-10-2020, 10:53 AM

Need screen shots. You may have settings that force limits which interfere with optimal bets. SCORE is what counts.

**Grobbelaar** · 10-10-2020, 07:38 PM

Bildschirmfoto 2020-10-10 um 16.30.34.jpg Bildschirmfoto 2020-10-10 um 16.30.58.jpg Bildschirmfoto 2020-10-10 um 21.35.28.jpg Bildschirmfoto 2020-10-10 um 21.35.48.jpg

**Norm** · 10-10-2020, 08:13 PM

You have Manually adjust Min Bet turned on. That will reduce the ability to create optimal betting with poor rules -- although it will do its best to optimize under the conditions set. You can only do so much with poor rules and constraints.

**Grobbelaar** · 10-10-2020, 08:50 PM

Thanks!

But still I'm confused, why with H17 rules it's so different than with S17 rules.. With H17 there is hardly any difference

**Freightman** · 10-10-2020, 09:02 PM

Originally Posted by Grobbelaar

Thanks!

But still I'm confused, why with H17 rules it's so different than with S17 rules.. With H17 there is hardly any difference

You can expect a large increase in $win rate, regardless of H17 or S17, with Surrender over non surrender games. I don’t know how much difference there is by following Norms suggestion. If not much, then something else is at play.

I note the shitty deck pen, and make reference to a prior post in a recent thread, where I said something about S17 making up for some shitty deck pen. You will see that difference in your sims. Of course, Snarky decided to affix his own version of what I said. He usually gets it wrong though.

Curious though, are you using an unbalanced count system - if so, what?

**Grobbelaar** · 10-10-2020, 09:08 PM

Yes, it's unbalanced... REKO .. with some adjustments ... but I find it strange that surrender with S17 has so much more effect than with H17

**Freightman** · 10-10-2020, 09:14 PM

Originally Posted by Grobbelaar

Yes, it's unbalanced... REKO .. with some adjustments ... but I find it strange that surrender with S17 has so much more effect than with H17

To clarify
Your H17 sims are not right. There should be a big difference, roughly 1/3 difference between your H17 Surrender vs H17 non surrender games. Further, S17 is such a valuable rule, that the $win rate between H17 and S17 games is significant.

**Grobbelaar** · 10-10-2020, 09:31 PM

But what did I wrong with the sims? That's one simulation I did with these 4 rules ... and that's what I got.
I will try to run another simulation.

I'm still learning about the software. But I don't know what's wrong.

**Freightman** · 10-10-2020, 09:43 PM

Originally Posted by Grobbelaar

But what did I wrong with the sims? That's one simulation I did with these 4 rules ... and that's what I got.
I will try to run another simulation.

I'm still learning about the software. But I don't know what's wrong.

try it with both 4.5/6 and 5.0/6, both H17 and S17. Just a thought, but overall $win rates will increase significantly, SCORE will rise significantly, and the expected much higher rate of surrender in a higher deck pen game might shock the H17 surrender win rate out of the doldrums caused by 4.0/6.

besides, especially as a newbie, you don’t want to be playing 4/6.

**Grobbelaar** · 10-10-2020, 10:06 PM

Hmmm.... I tried another simulation... it's about the same.... H17 DAS vs H17 DAS Sr is about the same.... no matter how the penetration is ... Even the score is slightly less with Surrender.... If I only knew what I'm doing wrong. It doesn't make sense to me. :-(

**Freightman** · 10-10-2020, 10:11 PM

Originally Posted by Grobbelaar

Hmmm.... I tried another simulation... it's about the same.... H17 DAS vs H17 DAS Sr is about the same.... no matter how the penetration is ... Even the score is slightly less with Surrender.... If I only knew what I'm doing wrong. It doesn't make sense to me. :-(

Did you buy the software, or did you download the demo?