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Thread: Native Dealers' Penetration

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  1. 07-17-2018, 10:27 PM #1
    Optimus Prime
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    Native Dealers' Penetration

    I've been playing a a local Indian casino with a good 6D game (h17, LS, DAS, RSA) where most dealers cut off 1-1.5 decks of the shoe so you're getting at least 75% pen, sometimes 80%. Once in a while a dealer will cut off more than 1.5 decks and I find another table.

    I play the nickel tables mostly, and as far as I can tell, this casino is not at all concerned with counters. I blatantly back-count and aggressively wong, move my bet directly with my advantage, etc. and no one seems to care.

    Last night I back-counted a shoe until there were only 3 rounds to go. I jumped in over the objections of a superstitious ploppy, played table minimum for a hand, won, jumped directly to my high bet (only 3X table minimum) for the next two hands, winning 10 units on 3 rounds before the cut card came out.

    When the dealer placed the cut card in the next shoe, he cut off a full 2 decks! Terrible pen for this casino. I wasted no time in leaving the table to find a better game.

    I don't know if this was heat directly from a dealer, if he always gives poor pen, or if he was just seeing whether it would make me leave the table.

    Normally I don't think dealers care much about APs, but it occurred to me this dealer was likely a member of the tribe who owns the casino - perhaps trying to preserve some of the casino's revenue?

    Questions for you:

    1) Anyone find that, at Indian casinos, tribe member employees are less friendly to counters than non-tribe members?
    2) What should I have done in this situation? Played through the next shoe just to make it look good? Left the casino? Not read so much into it?
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  2. 07-17-2018, 11:50 PM #2
    stopgambling
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    I personally agree in native casino some dealers will counter you . I have had many instance that the dealer took it upon themselves to counter an ap . You can also have a dual rate dealing to you .
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  3. 07-18-2018, 03:12 AM #3
    KingZen
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    Native casinos cant be trusted and only a fool will play at them. They have no enforcement regulation at all amd answer to themselves. State regulated casinos can barely be trusted and youre gonna trust these rigged ass indians? Give me a break.
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  4. 07-18-2018, 08:41 PM #4
    Midwest Player
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingZen View Post
    Native casinos cant be trusted and only a fool will play at them. They have no enforcement regulation at all amd answer to themselves. State regulated casinos can barely be trusted and youre gonna trust these rigged ass indians? Give me a break.
    Since most of my blackjack play has been at Indian casinos, I have to disagree with your statement. I don't feel I have been cheated at any of them, and I have played at many different Indian casinos over the years. Yeah, I had some back offs, but they were all polite. One pit boss let me play until closing before he backed me off.
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  5. 07-21-2018, 03:02 PM #5
    chucky baby
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingZen View Post
    Native casinos cant be trusted and only a fool will play at them. They have no enforcement regulation at all amd answer to themselves. State regulated casinos can barely be trusted and youre gonna trust these rigged ass indians? Give me a break.
    "Rigged ass indians" is a disgustingly racist thing to say. You should be thoroughly ashamed and Norm shouldn't permit it on this forum.
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  6. 07-21-2018, 03:03 PM #6
    ZeeBabar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chucky baby View Post
    "Rigged ass indians" is a disgustingly racist thing to say. You should be thoroughly ashamed and Norm shouldn't permit it on this forum.
    +100
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  7. 07-21-2018, 09:01 PM #7
    Freightman
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    Quote Originally Posted by chucky baby View Post
    "Rigged ass indians" is a disgustingly racist thing to say. You should be thoroughly ashamed and Norm shouldn't permit it on this forum.
    Agreed
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  8. 06-18-2019, 02:33 PM #8
    Old, but not dead
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    Quote Originally Posted by chucky baby View Post
    "Rigged ass indians" is a disgustingly racist thing to say. You should be thoroughly ashamed and Norm shouldn't permit it on this forum.
    I am amazed at how many times the word "Indian" is used on this forum. I thought there was only one small casino in Mumbai? The population of my city is over 25% South Asian, and even they like being called Brown, not "Indian". We also have 5% First Nation population. My daughters middle school was named after Dan George, and her principal was Mr. Singh. I like to use proper names if avaialble (Ie. Lummi, Tsawwassen, Musqueam, Lil'wat, S?wx?wú7mesh, etc.). This racist crap needs to end now!
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  9. 06-18-2019, 03:39 PM #9
    Freightman
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old, but not dead View Post
    I am amazed at how many times the word "Indian" is used on this forum. I thought there was only one small casino in Mumbai? The population of my city is over 25% South Asian, and even they like being called Brown, not "Indian". We also have 5% First Nation population. My daughters middle school was named after Dan George, and her principal was Mr. Singh. I like to use proper names if avaialble (Ie. Lummi, Tsawwassen, Musqueam, Lil'wat, S?wx?wú7mesh, etc.). This racist crap needs to end now!
    Fellow Canuck, I see. From British Columbia, I assume.
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  10. 06-18-2019, 04:23 PM #10
    Freightman
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freightman View Post
    Fellow Canuck, I see. From British Columbia, I assume.
    Are you originally from Abbotsford or Surrey. Clues abound, as many as the stars in the sky. My favourite Chief Dan George line is from the link below.

    https://youtu.be/CEYnb22LkjA
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  11. 06-18-2019, 04:40 PM #11
    Freightman
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freightman View Post
    Are you originally from Abbotsford or Surrey. Clues abound, as many as the stars in the sky. My favourite Chief Dan George line is from the link below.

    https://youtu.be/CEYnb22LkjA
    Another great Chief Dan George link, from the Oulaw Josey Wales

    https://youtu.be/atzmdijMfRY
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  12. 06-19-2019, 12:30 PM #12
    Old, but not dead
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freightman View Post
    Are you originally from Abbotsford or Surrey. Clues abound, as many as the stars in the sky. My favourite Chief Dan George line is from the link below.

    https://youtu.be/CEYnb22LkjA
    Orginally from New Westminster, but I now live in Abbotsford. Plenty of clues as to where I lived in previous posts, since I had already commented on bringing money through the border, US bank accounts and WA. State First nation stores

    "When these stores first opened in Wa. in the early 90's, they were extremely beatable. You had to watch carefully for dealer errors, but you could play for hours with no heat. So many casinos were opening with little or no experienced staff. Since the tribes wanted employment for their members, very few experienced managers were brought in, and it was a free for all for years. In 1991, the Lummi tribe opened a casino. The Tulalip Tribe opened a casino in 1992, the Nooksack Tribe opened one in 1993, and the Swinomish, Colville, and Spokane Tribes opened theirs in 1994. Six more tribes opened casinos in 1995: Jamestown S’Klallam, Muckleshoot, Chehalis, Squaxin Island, Upper Skagit, Suquamish, and an extension of the Lummi Tribe casino. Man...do i miss those days. The First Nations stores in Wa. are still better than BC, but they have 25 years of experience now so you have to use more cover."
    Last edited by Old, but not dead; 06-19-2019 at 12:31 PM. Reason: Typo
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  13. 07-18-2018, 04:57 AM #13
    ZeeBabar
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    You can win in the short run with a 3 x minimum high bet in a 6 deck game but it's impossible not to get in trouble attempting to do it consistently, especially if you are hanging around for hours waiting for a count to wong in and out.
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