Confused how to play 88v10 and 88vA

**trotch** · 01-27-2018, 07:44 PM

88v10 and 88vA are giving me trouble, and I'm not sure how to think about it...

I know basic strategy for h17 games is to split these.

Against 10, continue to split all the way to +9, then stand. But, if surrender is allowed, Surrender at +2. Is that right? And it's split on negative counts as well?

I've seen charts in which 88vA is split and charts in which 88vA is surrendered. What true counts is it split/hit/stood/surrendered? I can't figure this out.

And I assume there are differences in how these hands should be played optimally in s17 vs h17 games, because player 18 beats dealer A6 in s17 games.

So 1) How the hell are these hands optimally played, and 2) does anyone have any tips for remembering the index numbers for the correct plays?

Thanks for any help you can provide.

**Freightman** · 01-27-2018, 08:06 PM

Surrender takes precedence. Hi lo or halves, surrender 88 to minus 2, split below. 97 or 10,6 v 10, add -3, i.e. Surrender to -5. Before more depth, provide your count system, as the index numbers may be different.

**trotch** · 01-27-2018, 08:25 PM

Hi-lo estimating whole decks for TC conversion

**Freightman** · 01-27-2018, 08:33 PM

Originally Posted by trotch

Hi-lo estimating whole decks for TC conversion

Your bible, with tables galore, us Wongs Professional Blackjack. The hard civer is slightly different than the online version. You should have them both.

All of your answers are there. You specifically want the early and Kate surrender tables on pages 91,83, and the hi lo tables starting around page 250.

**trotch** · 01-27-2018, 08:37 PM

Ah beautiful, thanks for the tip. I'd already ordered that book and am expecting it in the mail any day now. Can't wait to dive in.

**Freightman** · 01-27-2018, 08:39 PM

Originally Posted by trotch

Ah beautiful, thanks for the tip. I'd already ordered that book and am expecting it in the mail any day now. Can't wait to dive in.

That was pages 91, 93, not 91,83

**umbrellaman** · 01-27-2018, 09:17 PM

Originally Posted by trotch

So 1) How the hell are these hands optimally played, and 2) does anyone have any tips for remembering the index numbers for the correct plays?

For a new player I highly recommend buying CVBJ and using the "mask" option so you can start with as many indices as you're comfortable with. You'll find all the answers you're looking for there (specific to the game you want to target). Practice for a while and all of your deviations will be locked into your memory. You should also buy Wong's book for your library.

**Meistro123** · 01-27-2018, 10:03 PM

this is a good tool for basic strategy questions, as you can enter in rules and it outputs basic strategy

https://www.blackjackinfo.com/blackj...rategy-engine/

88 v A is a split in a S17 game and a surrender in a H17 game

**DSchles** · 01-28-2018, 08:35 AM

Originally Posted by Freightman

Your bible, with tables galore, us Wongs Professional Blackjack. The hard civer is slightly different than the online version. You should have them both.

All of your answers are there. You specifically want the early and Kate surrender tables on pages 91,83, and the hi lo tables starting around page 250.

As I recall, the original question was about surrendering 8,8 vs. 10 and ace in a H17 game. Can you point me to where in either of Wong's books we can find that index? Oh.

Don

**Freightman** · 01-28-2018, 09:14 AM

Originally Posted by DSchles

As I recall, the original question was about surrendering 8,8 vs. 10 and ace in a H17 game. Can you point me to where in either of Wong's books we can find that index? Oh.

Don

Page 91-early surrender, page 93-late surrender, both look pretty good to me.

**DSchles** · 01-28-2018, 11:09 AM

Originally Posted by Freightman

Page 91-early surrender, page 93-late surrender, both look pretty good to me.

I have two different editions of Wong's Pro BJ (green cover) and two of the "Bible" version. None of the four has an index for late surrendering 8,8 vs. ace in a H17 game. You have that???

Don

**Freightman** · 01-28-2018, 11:15 AM

Originally Posted by DSchles

I have two different editions of Wong's Pro BJ (green cover) and two of the "Bible" version. None of the four has an index for late surrendering 8,8 vs. ace in a H17 game. You have that???

Don

Green cover , Professional Blackjack, printed 2005. My copy , pages 91,93.

**ZeeBabar** · 01-28-2018, 12:00 PM

Will someone answer the question where Surrender is not offered? Your experiences help.

Say you have a max bet out, TC is sky high, you get a pair of 8's vs. 10. How have you handled it?

If its against an Ace, the dealer does not have a BJ, do you always split when you have a max bet on the table?