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Thread: Next Step in Hi-Lo

  1. #1


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    Next Step in Hi-Lo

    If I've gotten the Hi-Lo system down (100% at a fairly fast pace) with I18 and F4, 6D, H17, what would be the next techniques / counts to add. I'm rounding down the remaining deck estimation to 1 deck, right now.

  2. #2


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    Add more indexes.

  3. #3


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    Head to the casino and start playing. There is nothing as good as learning in the casino environment.

  4. #4


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    I meant truncating the true count and, rounding up on the deck estimation. Wondering if it's better to learn the rest of the indices, incorporate a side count, or improve deck estimation to halves? I've been having fun instantiating the knowledge - last time out, I was busted with the pit boss standing directly in my line of sight of the discard tray - nice big smile on his face - so, I still got stuff to work on live. But, I'm getting better at not responding to errors and, holding light conversations, also.

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    better deck estimation ,to half a deck and then to quarter deck for the last deck anyway

  6. #6


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    This is the classic situation discussed regarding advice to new players. Advice ranges from "learn more indexes" to learn new count (Wong Halves......what will ZMF say??).

    My advice is you need experience, so play ~1000 rounds live while believing you have made no errors (does not mean you didn't make any, only that you are not aware of them if you did!). Presumes you have a bankroll suitable for the level of play you will undertake. If not, then STOP and research and develop bet structures to fit your games. Be certain that you are savvy enough to make good game selections and disciplined enough to walk when they are not. If deficit in this area, then STOP, research, learn and perfect.

    When all of these are well mastered, and you plan on playing at an very active recreational lone wolf or to become a full time professional, then STOP, research, master higher level count and start over with practice at low bet levels to get experience. Again, when all is rock solid then go to war. If you plan on remaining a part time recreational player, then master what you learned with HiLo, add some indexes and enjoy the ride.
    Luck is nothing more than probability taken personally!

  7. #7


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    Thanks. I'll put in a lot more hours. Discipline I'm not worried about. I just trust the math. I hope to get to Halves by the end of the year. I take it most would just double the numbers to eliminate the fractions - no downside to doing it that way?

  8. #8


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    Agree with stealth. If you haven't started playing yet, you're ready since you've got the foundational necessary skills down. Most of the valuable things you can learn at this point will be through experience and asking questions that come up. Also when players have reached that point, regardless of your bankroll size cvcx becomes a must, must (Zee).

  9. #9


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    learn all the non pair indexes between 1 and 6

  10. #10


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    As far as live play, at this stage, since you indicate that you may have already been made at least once, I suggest flat betting at a low limit table while playing basic strategy and doing everything else you need to do (running count, true count, betting calculations, identifying index plays) until you get used to the environment and can act naturally while doing it. The floor should have no reason to evaluate your play while you're doing this, due to the minimum bet flat betting. In this way you can accumulate live experience at a relatively low cost.

  11. #11


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    Quote Originally Posted by grassyknoll63 View Post
    Thanks. I'll put in a lot more hours. Discipline I'm not worried about. I just trust the math. I hope to get to Halves by the end of the year. I take it most would just double the numbers to eliminate the fractions - no downside to doing it that way?
    Doubling the numbers and then dividing by 2 is what some guys do - for them, it makes it easier than dealing with fractions. I think of it as an unnecessary step that simp,y slows down the speed preprocess.

    Use flash cards and deal with fractions. It becomes second nature after awhile.

  12. #12


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    Quote Originally Posted by Gronbog View Post
    As far as live play, at this stage, since you indicate that you may have already been made at least once, I suggest flat betting at a low limit table while playing basic strategy and doing everything else you need to do (running count, true count, betting calculations, identifying index plays) until you get used to the environment and can act naturally while doing it. The floor should have no reason to evaluate your play while you're doing this, due to the minimum bet flat betting. In this way you can accumulate live experience at a relatively low cost.
    +1 I'll second that. I would also suggest that in doing this, practice with all kinds of situations. Practice with a full table sitting at third base. Practice sitting at centerfield. Practice heads up with a fast dealer. Practice your wong-out point and where the next best table is that's ready to shuffle. Practice how you're going to jump your bet at TC +2. Practice arranging your seat to allow you to spread to 2 hands. Etc.

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