How to react when one is being accused being a counter.

**chang04133** · 01-28-2013, 02:44 PM

I have been practicing counting, and my counting skill will be mastered in the next consecutive years (by that year, I am straightly entering to casino)
For now, I can counts 6 deck of cards under any conditions (like starting hands, or full hands) under 1 minute and 40 secs with 90%~100% accuracy. (still working on)
Lets not talk about this.
I want to know how to reacts when I am being considered as a counter.
I do not fear being backed-off by pits, but I fear that they take my picture and share my profile with the other casinos.
I want to avoid that incident as much as possible, because I do not want to be barred from any casinos, especially in Las Vegas, in the U.S
I have 50k Bankroll, and is willing to play 25~300 or 50~500 spreads.
And the minimum condition I should seek for is 17S/ DAS/ 6 DECKS/ Double Any cards/ 70~75 PEN.

RS · 01-28-2013, 03:28 PM

That should be 100% accuracy. If you can count a single deck in 20 seconds, you're fine. Of course, practice starting at high and low counts (ie: Start at +11 an end with +11, or start at -17 and end on -17, etc.). Don't stare at the damn cards when you're playing. Don't stare at the discard tray. Go to the casino a few times (without counting) and figure out how other people play, react, move, etc. You don't want to be a robot. Relax, chat with the dealer, smoke a stogie, you're a gambler, not a robotic card-counter (at least, you want to appear a gambler). Don't go mouthing off statistics. Make up voodoo stuff, "there's no way the dealer can bust with a 6!!" Or a "dealer ALWAYS gets a 20 on the fird hand of the shoe" or after the dealer completes a hand with a bust-card out, "Damn, it's because no one took a hit!" The more retarded **** you can think of, the better. If it sounds retarded, say it.

**stopgambling** · 01-28-2013, 03:40 PM

The more retarded are your comments ,the better

love this!

**Tom** · 01-28-2013, 03:41 PM

The first time a pit suspected me I got real nervous. They didn't start paying attention until I had doubled my buy in. But, I kept my cool because while the PB suspected me, the dealer did not. Pit came up, did some whispering with the dealer (who disagreed with her suspicions), check of the discards and that was it. After that the pit started watching the dealer instead of me. Apparently someone upstairs phoned shenanigans so the PB was trying to figure out who.

I just try to keep a straight face and pretend nothing is wrong. If I was to get up and leave that would just confirm their suspicions. I also order beer and make a couple mistakes while the pit is watching.

**Ouchez** · 01-28-2013, 03:51 PM

Chang,

When you start, the first half year, play like you have a $6,000 bank roll. After that first 6 months reconsider everything when reviewing your results. Keep accurate records, and when playing have an act, don't be a BoBot,(that is a Robot but my grandson pronounces it BoBot

).

Ouchez

**incog421** · 01-28-2013, 04:02 PM

it is all about your act, chang. as has been said by others, you must think like an AP, and act like a gambler. The trick is to get the most out of your camo. know when you are getting attention. that is when you pull out your bag of bulls*** superstitions. be consistent in your act. Ask the dealer, PB or other players for advise. (take it when it is correct, spout off some dismissing superstition when they are wrong) Never admit to playing perfect BS. I have never had a dealer that truly knew every BS for their game. Lots will say they do. Let them believe it! And just remember: you are doing nothing wrong. getting worried or nervous will only confirm their suspicions.

nothing will help you as much as some real world experience.

**incog421** · 01-28-2013, 04:03 PM

Originally Posted by Ouchez

Chang,

When you start, the first half year, play like you have a $6,000 bank roll. After that first 6 months reconsider everything when reviewing your results. Keep accurate records, and when playing have an act, don't be a BoBot,(that is a Robot but my grandson pronounces it BoBot

).

Ouchez

+1

**bigplayer** · 01-28-2013, 04:12 PM

They never "accuse you" of being a counter. They just tell you that they've made a business decision and that you're style of play is not welcome at the casino anymore and then tell you whether you're welcome to play other games or whether they just want you to cash your chips and leave and never come back. Some casinos may surround you with security guards and try to get you to show ID to them (refuse) and accompany them to the security office to sign some documents (decline). Card Counting is not a crime, do not let them treat you like a criminal. They know it's not illegal and know they cannot prove you were counting cards even if it's against house policy so they never actually come out and tell you a reason except something nebulous like "sir, we are a private business and reserve the right to refuse service and we just no longer want to deal to you." or "your action is just too strong for us."

The best way to act is to maybe look surprised and reluctant but just silently pick up your chips and walk immediately at a normal speed directly to the exit. You want to leave as little of an impression as you possibly can as the less memorable you are the easier it will be to recycle that casino later on and the less likely that employee will be to remember you in a few years when he leaves to go to another property. Do not cash your chips...just take them with you and come back on another trip to cash them or sell them to another AP. Do not color up to high denomination chips...just shove all of the chips you have on the table into your pockets and leave....maybe color up the green to black.

**Zach Black** · 01-28-2013, 05:06 PM

Originally Posted by bigplayer

Do not cash your chips...just take them with you and come back on another trip to cash them or sell them to another AP.

What's the downside of cashing chips on the way out? Is it the better cameras at the cage?

**RWM** · 01-28-2013, 06:03 PM

Yes, the best camera angles are at the cage.

**Intermediate** · 01-28-2013, 06:13 PM

Chang, I applaud your eagerness to learn, but I politely suggest that you would gain a lot by first driving your skills playing Red and managing your play to a 6-10k bank and comfortable RoR. There's a lot to the mental aspects of the game that you only gain through mileage, outside of dealing with the heat and inevitable back-offs starting at Green. That's not to say you won't encounter them playing Red in the right conditions. Just don't wait to become book smart before getting a little dirty....

**chang04133** · 01-28-2013, 06:43 PM

But playing with RED CHIP sucks that I am forced to play with the rules of 8 DECK Hit soft 17, DAS UP TO 3, something like that.
I am keep practicing card-counting.
I think I really have to pretend i am superstitious about blackjack, especially since I am an Asian.

**Intermediate** · 01-28-2013, 07:09 PM

I know what you mean, but you can find 6D, $10 games and 2D $10-$15 min. games in Las Vegas, Tunica, and elsewhere. You just have to do your research. It's easier to take the learning curve (it can be harsh) at smaller stakes, especially if you have a bigger bankroll. Get CVBJ and play out your scenarios. It may be an eye opener to see the Variance, and at minimum, it will give you free practice to hone your counting, TC calculations, and index plays.