Running for Cover, leaving a high count shoe

[Freightman]

Well, my ploppies care about it, and I suspect Marriedputter has heard the same comments. Sometimes it can be utilized to an advantage. People are loosing, but the count is climbing, so you go to two hands to "mess up the cards". You Wong out in a neg shoe and they loose, it's BECAUSE you messed up the cards. In one local place, there's a group of Asian women who avoid me because I table hop and mess up the cards...lol

You need to develop a hard head and thick skin, compensating with well timed compassion for certain tablemates. I can't recall the number of times that ploppies have chastised my play. Funny thing, they never say anything when ruining the flow helps them win.

[RCJH]

Freightman, I don't give too hoots what my tablemates think of my play.

I do, however, give too hoots about being welcome in my local stores. Happy ploppies equal a happy pit, so I play nice locally, and I respect thier superstitions to the degree it can help me.

[Freightman]

Freightman, I don't give too hoots what my tablemates think of my play.

I do, however, give too hoots about being welcome in my local stores. Happy ploppies equal a happy pit, so I play nice locally, and I respect thier superstitions to the degree it can help me.

Valid comments. The pit does love a happy table.

[CHAM]

Hey MP, Your a very smart AP. Remember You can shear a sheep many times but skin only once.

[marriedputter]

I personally think it's a great idea to leave the table as soon as the count is very high. OP -- please text me when this happens and I'll join the table when you leave so as to not arouse suspicions.

Tell you what, pay me a finders fee if you win, and I'll be happy to.

[marriedputter]

This is key. When I made my comment, I didn't know this. It was based on looking like a gambler because that's what I assumed they thought you were. If they know you're a counter, then you need to convince them that you're not a threat or, at the very least, not going to be a problem. Your strategy may help with the latter, but it would be even better if you could maintain your entire advantage without them knowing it.

I'm interested in this topic, because I am somewhat in the same boat.

My method of maintaining my advantage without them knowing it is encompassed in my betting style and demeanor. Anybody watching me would think that I am just all over the place. Some of my betting style was found in some of the books that are often mentioned around here. The other part is an invention of my own. I don't want to give anything away on here, but let's just say that it severely lacks consistency to the untrained eye. As for my demeanor, well, I probably shouldn't mention that here either. But I definitely don't look like I know what I'm doing. I love the act. It's quite fun to play the part of a doofus.

[marriedputter]

How you win it is a factor as well. I am like you trying to win reasonable amounts at any sitting but I don't walk away from an advantage. Most of my wins and loses are well within tolerances but you can win or lose $3K to $8K in one shoe

Great gobs of goose crap, where the hell do you play? I would love to be able to take those amounts! If I tried that where I am, my ass would be cracking the concrete outside.

Every place is different but the places I play seem to understand that and as long as it is obvious your goal is not to win much they are fine with aberrations in a shoe. I won't tell you how to be because each store is different and you know your stores.

My places are that way too, but certainly with limits that are far less than yours. Red play is far more prevalent than green play. Black play is damn near unheard of.

Just be aware that regularly walking away from an advantage means you aren't playing with the advantage you think you are and all your sim stats are incorrect for that play.

I take issue with the word “regularly” because it is hardly regular. This is the “super-spicy-hot” shoe that comes up maybe once or twice a year (given my frequency of play which is probably less than yours).

I don't think the amount you win is as much a consequence as the mindset they believe you have.

I am a little confused on what you mean by “the mindset they believe you have.”

Same boat here. I slowed my play toward the end of last year because I had won so much. I know my regular haunts know what I am doing but are comfortable with what I do at their specific stores. I do worry because I don't want to lose any stores as well.

So if I may, it sounds like a condensed form of what you are saying in this post, is “it depends.” It sounds like you moderate yourself as I do. However, you are still willing to tip into a sizeable win on one visit. Sounds like your boat rocks a little more than mine, but we both stay afloat.

[marriedputter]

Since they know you are successful counter, you know their tolerance, and you were at that point, then I think you made the right call. No sense in poking the bear if you can slip in and steal its honey without waking it.

A fine analogy for my philosophy.

If you are certain they know you are a counter, but play nice and remain within their tolerance, why bother with camo and changing styles? Or are you referring to the stores that you aren't sure if they know you are an AP?

First, let me backpedal a little. I don't "know" that they know. There have just been several hints dropped at both places, some subtle, some more direct. So, if I can make them doubt themselves a little, I may be able to buy myself more time. The most important thing, is that I do not want to be predictable. Just when they think they may have me figured out, I throw something else at them. I want them to think that either I have lost my mind, or they were never right about me to begin with. Regardless, there are clearly some people there that don't suspect me at all. I have no way of knowing what they are thinking. I breathe it all in though, their words, their looks, their body language, etc. If I have been throwing fast balls, it's time for a curve ball, then a change up, etc. I have seen some pretty confused looks at times, which I savor.
Screwing with their minds is part of the fun for me. The last thing that I want to do is bet like a robot. It's obvious and quite frankly boring.

[marriedputter]

Thats one thing ploppies really don't care about.

Really? They sure do here! I wonged out three times in a row recently and made a ploppy eat up a TC-4 three shoes in a row. He wasn't pleased. Obviously thought his losing was due to me. He was clearly holding his anger in. Oh well, his problem. He chose to gamble.

[marriedputter]

Funny thing, they never say anything when ruining the flow helps them win.

Part of my big win recently was due to a ploppy on 3rd base doing something totally stupid that ended up saving my tail.

[marriedputter]

Hey MP, Your a very smart AP.

Hell yeah I am.

Remember You can shear a sheep many times but skin only once.

...a lesson that Worm has never bothered to learn!

Wait a minute, don't I know you CHAM? Oh wait a minute, I didn't notice that was a $25 table!

[Three]

Great gobs of goose crap, where the hell do you play? I would love to be able to take those amounts! If I tried that where I am, my ass would be cracking the concrete outside.

You missed the point. I don't win that at a sitting generally but rarely within a shoe I win or lose that much. Casinos seem to be okay with whatever happens within a shoe as long as your bet isn't too big and you are satisfied with the win. I don't try to win or lose that much but it happens.

I am a little confused on what you mean by “the mindset they believe you have.”

Do they think you are out to win as much as possible or a ridiculous amount or just win a reasonable amount before leaving between shoes. The casino makes assessments of your play, how deep your pockets are and a greed factor assessment. Other than your play they are all educated guesses based on what they see.

[marriedputter]

You missed the point. I don't win that at a sitting generally but rarely within a shoe I win or lose that much. Casinos seem to be okay with whatever happens within a shoe as long as your bet isn't too big and you are satisfied with the win. I don't try to win or lose that much but it happens.

Do they think you are out to win as much as possible or a ridiculous amount or just win a reasonable amount before leaving between shoes. The casino makes assessments of your play, how deep your pockets are and a greed factor assessment. Other than your play they are all educated guesses based on what they see.

I didn't miss the point. I just still can't believe that whatever happens in just one shoe is okay with the casino. Counters have all sorts of rules to follow (tempering spread, 45-minute rule, etc). It seems that you are saying that as long as your spread is reasonable, you can win as much as you want if it happens to occur in one shoe. I'm still skeptical, but you have come the closest to convincing me T3.