I'm considering switching from HiLo to Halves and I'd like some advice from any experts among you. Do you double the tag values and indices or not? Are there any important differences with the indices compared to HiLo? How long should I expect it to take to get fast enough and accurate enough to use it in the casino? Is it worth making the change? I play shoe games exclusively and play about 150 hours per year. Thanks!
1. Do you have the desire for it. If so, start off with flat betting and keeping halves count.Originally Posted by Cardguy
2. Players both double values. and use fractions. Doubling values so gives you marginally more accuracy on indices. I use fractions - it's a shitload faster, and no dealer can keep up to me in a speed contest.
3. Beauty of hi lo to halves is that indices (using fractions) are virtually identical to halves, the most notable exception being insurance indices.
4. Wongs Professional Blackjack is an excellent reference for this project. Most relavent tables (whole book is great) would be the hi lo tables starting around page 250, and the halves tables starting around 275.
5. If you double the fractions,then you have to divide by 2 to match the hi lo indices.
Hope this helps.
"If you double the fractions, then you have to divide by 2 to match the hi lo indices."
Not necessarily true. As with RPC, just reckon the TC by dividing by half decks remaining, instead of full decks, and leave the RC alone. The result will be indices that, for the most part, match Hi-Lo.
Don
Good point. Question is what is faster. I would think my way, though I'm happy to stand corrected, is more accurate, since the masses are not necessarily good or fast enough to divide by half decks. You're excluded since you're likely an anomaly
Actually, it is I that play shoe games exclusively, and play around 150 hours per year..... :-)
Until around four years ago, I used Hi-Lo (35 index numbers) exclusively. At that time, I switched to Halves. So that I could keep the same index numbers (in most cases), I used the "half" amount, via saying "K" in my head to mean "and a half"- If I was at +6, and the next four cards were 2, 7, 5, A, I would think "6K, 7, 8K, 7K". But it really didn't take very long to switch. I changed my insurance index from 3 to 3.5, but don't recall changing any others- though I recall that one (or two?) other index numbers, of the 35 I use, could have used a change of 1 also. Is it worth it? For me, definitely. It really wasn't hard for me to do at all. For you, maybe- I guess if counting by half values isn't easy, it may be more difficult to do.
Far harder was what I did a couple of years ago, changing to using a second (balanced) count, and side-counting aces, for a blackjack variant in which doing so is worth it (simulation proven). That is far tougher- keeping one count in numbers, one (a level three) count in letters....
that game and those hours....likely not worth it, imo
assuming:
~ stakes are fixed (not increasing with 'better mousetrap')
~ hour studying/training = hour less playing
looking at ~20 xtra hrs of ev/yr...of course, everyone's learning curve is different....if it takes you 40 hrs to be at same proficiency as current....you cost yourself 2 yrs until get ROI
I suggest learning more indices as they can be transferred at later date
You need to be very accurate on the ASC, or you're fucked. BC's are equivalent, after hi opt 2 ASC..
PE's are stronger with Hi Opt 2 with Ace Side Count. Add an ASC ((already reckoned for betting) to halves, and PE's are much closer. IC is stronger with hi opt - but, can you keep count with the fastest dealers accurately sudecounting aces with remaining half or quarter deck conversion. Can you keep up at 300 hph plus, or do you cap at 150-200 Hph. You need speed, greasy speed.
I'll trade side counts for 300 plus hph. Doubt you could keep up with me, and stay accurate. There goes any edge that you perceive.
https://youtu.be/N0GdQyIm7DU
Last edited by Freightman; 02-26-2017 at 03:10 PM.
You have espoused the beauty of hi opt of keeping you welcome with lower spread, and not getting picked off.
Another item. 300 plus hph keeping ASC without checking the discard tray. Can u do it. I only have to look at the discard tray for close index decisions.
Not necessarily true. Hi-OPT II and Wong Halves goes back and forth in performance for different Blackjack games. In some games Halves is stronger than Hi-OPT II, like 8 deck S17, DAS, LS. Don't believe me run a simulation and chart Halves against Hi-OPT II. But in other games Hi-OPT II beats Halves.
Last edited by seriousplayer; 02-26-2017 at 08:35 PM.
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