I have been flat bet outside of Missouri. Nothing led me to believe they couldn't bar me. Most casinos implement countermeasures before barring. All Missouri seemed to do was officially standardize the practice.Originally Posted by mcallister3200
So I'm no lawyer, but I did sleep in a Holiday Inn Express last night.
I also read (or tried to sift through) the laws on the Missouri Gaming Commission website.
It looks like Missouri defines Blackjack, as well as some other table games, as games of skill. You can't exclude people from beating games of skill--just cheating them. They define cheating as team play, or using devices, or having inside info not available to he general public. For that, you can exclude.
You can also exclude unsavory people, and there's a list of offenses which would qualify you as an unsavory person.
Finally, they maintain a public list on the Internet of all excluded persons. In the past ten years, it looks like there may be 50 name on that list.
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No, he didn't. He says the law defines blackjack as a game of skill (which I'm taking on faith, because I have my doubts). He then says "You can't exclude people from games of skill." Structurally, that's a second-person statement sandwiched between two third-person statements; and it genuinely appears to be his own interpretation.
Box, do you just like to argue?
Here's the link to the Missouri gaming website.
From there, follow the links to all the regulations. You can read them all yourself, if you'd prefer.
http://www.mgc.dps.mo.gov/
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I read the rules. A Snyder article cites the rule where 'tracking cards is not cheating' as authority for his statement that Missouri can't bar counters. However, after reading it, all I see are a bunch of procedures that are probably implemented 24/7 to prevent pro card counting attacks. While also making sure to prevent legal issues arising out of pit critters picking out random suspicious people, accusing them of cheating, and having security manhandle them.
Then I went to the Policies section. (3) The holder of a Class A or B license isexpressly prohibited from the following activities: (J)...to permit any typeof conduct on the riverboat which reflectsnegatively on the repute of the state of Missourior acts as a detriment to the gamingindustry;
Does card counting act to the detriment of the gaming industry? I believe the casinos believe that it does. So this law specifically forbids NOT barring card counters. That's a bit of a strong reading, but I think this reg is more clear than the other one supposedly not allowing casinos to 86 anyone. So I'm still waiting for my explanation. I wouldn't have asked if I could find the answer on my own. If all anyone can come up with is a link to a homepage, then I'm convinced no one knows what they are talking about and it's completely OK for them to ban people.
I'm not arguing to argue. I wanted to know. But I don't mind arguing, I'm good at it.
Card counting was the biggest boom the gaming industry ever saw. Before that BJ was a fringe game. Now it brings more people into the casino than would ever visit because they see games as being beatable whether they know how to do it or not. This is historic fact that continues to this day and is not subject to debate. Each new moving is followed a revenue boom for the casino.
They can 86 you for misconduct but not going in and legally playing their game using your mind. That is perfectly reasonable and easy to understand. They are licensed by the state to offer games the state feels are games of skill and can't bar people simply because they play it legally as a game of skill. The countermeasures are 100% effective and there is no need for anything else.
Based on what law? You could say that about any other jurisdiction as an idealistic idea, but it simply isn't true in reality. Games of skill, by law, aren't gambling--that's the only legal issue there. Look at the whole fantasy sports debate. Blackjack is a game of chance. Whether it's a game of a skill or chance in Missouri doesn't matter, because we already know it's gambling.
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