Struggling with splits, using HiLo

[ZeeBabar]

My biggest issues are splitting decisions, given I play DD and 6Deck ( no single deck) HiLo with just the I-18 in games that do not offer Surrender options...

1. Splitting 8's against 9,10 in positive TC situations where I have a near Max bet or Max bet out. Fear of losing 2 max bets, maybe more if I draw another 8.

2. Splitting 6,6 against a 7.

3. Splitting 3,3 against 7's. When should we split if there is an 8 up?

4. Splitting 4,4 against a 5 or 6 with a TC of +2 or more.

any subtle tips in such situations from the pros here are appreciated.

[Ryemo]

I'm confused... Are you asking for correct index numbers, or are you stating that you have a hard time executing the proper plays when called for?

IF you're stating that you have a hard time executing the correct plays because you have a fear of losing, then you really need to reconsider playing AP BJ. I'm not a pro, but I'm sure any pro will tell you that you need to split when the index/strategy tells you to do so. And if you don't, you're just gambling. Simple!

IF you're asking for the correct strategy, then pick up a book and look it up. It isn't hard to find. And considering how long you've been playing, this should have been sorted out a long time ago...

[seriousplayer]

My biggest issues are splitting decisions, given I play DD and 6Deck ( no single deck) HiLo with just the I-18 in games that do not offer Surrender options...

1. Splitting 8's against 9,10 in positive TC situations where I have a near Max bet or Max bet out. Fear of losing 2 max bets, maybe more if I draw another 8.

2. Splitting 6,6 against a 7.

3. Splitting 3,3 against 7's. When should we split if there is an 8 up?

4. Splitting 4,4 against a 5 or 6 with a TC of +2 or more.

any subtle tips in such situations from the pros here are appreciated.

Answers are in red:

1. Splitting 8's against 9,10 in positive TC situations where I have a near Max bet or Max bet out. Fear of losing 2 max bets, maybe more if I draw another 8.

Split 8's vs 10 if TC < 8 since no surrendering is available. If surrendering is available you surrender 8's vs 10 at TC >= +2. There is no index deviation for 8's vs 9 using the Hi-lo count play basic strategy.

2. Splitting 6,6 against a 7.

There is no index deviation for 6,6 vs 7 using the Hi-lo count use basic strategy.

3. Splitting 3,3 against 7's. When should we split if there is an 8 up?

There is no index deviation for 3,3 vs 7 using Hi-lo count use basic strategy. To split against an 8 up the TC >= +4

4. Splitting 4,4 against a 5 or 6 with a TC of +2 or more.

Split 4,4 vs 5 at TC >= -2. Split 4,4 vs 6 at TC >= -5.

All answers are for six deck games.

Hope that helps!

[Bodarc]

My biggest issue is counting. I'm afraid when the count gets high the dealer may get a 10 so I don't do it usually.
I spend all of my winnings so my bankroll is only 100 bucks. Is this alright?
I don't want my wife to know I gamble even though I do it 5 days a week. Is she stupid or is it me?
I don't buy books because I only do things I want to, not what the books say.
What is the correct index number to double down on an Ace Ten?
I'm not sure I gamble because I want to make money or if I'm just a compulsive gambler. When I retire in 4 years I may read a book then.

If you don't like my posts, be kind and just over look them.

[ZeeBabar]

My biggest issue is counting. I'm afraid when the count gets high the dealer may get a 10 so I don't do it usually.
I spend all of my winnings so my bankroll is only 100 bucks. Is this alright?
I don't want my wife to know I gamble even though I do it 5 days a week. Is she stupid or is it me?
I don't buy books because I only do things I want to, not what the books say.
What is the correct index number to double down on an Ace Ten?
I'm not sure I gamble because I want to make money or if I'm just a compulsive gambler. When I retire in 4 years I may read a book then.

If you don't like my posts, be kind and just over look them.

aah, classy response, Bodarc. Thanks for taking the time to summarize for me. You are truly a gentleman's gentleman.

[ZeeBabar]

Answers are in red:

1. Splitting 8's against 9,10 in positive TC situations where I have a near Max bet or Max bet out. Fear of losing 2 max bets, maybe more if I draw another 8.

Split 8's vs 10 if TC < 8 since no surrendering is available. If surrendering is available you surrender 8's vs 10 at TC >= +2. There is no index deviation for 8's vs 9 using the Hi-lo count just play basic strategy.

2. Splitting 6,6 against a 7.

There is no index deviation for 6,6 vs 7 using the Hi-lo count just use basic strategy.

3. Splitting 3,3 against 7's. When should we split if there is an 8 up?

There is no index deviation for 3,3 vs 7 using Hi-lo count use basic strategy. To split against an 8 up the TC >= +4

4. Splitting 4,4 against a 5 or 6 with a TC of +2 or more.

Split 4,4 vs 5 at TC >= -2. Split 4,4 vs 6 at TC >= -5.

All answers are for six deck games.

Hope that helps!

Thanks serious player. Yes, I know the basic strategy answers. However, say the count goes TC+5, you have a max bet out, dealer has a 10 and you have 8,8. Basic strategy says split but do I want to lose another max bet? The odds, even when you split, are that you would lose both bets. Now, with a minimum bet out, in the long run, you would lose less by splitting. However, it's not often you get an 8,8 with a TC+5. Fact is that some pros do not split in such a situation, save one max bet.

i simply wanted to express that I have difficulty doing some of these splits with a max bet out. It's unfortunate that some, not you, with pent up hostilities and unable to masturbate, are waiting to take it out on some stranger on a forum.

[Thirdbaseman]

say the count goes TC+5, you have a max bet out, dealer has a 10 and you have 8,8. Basic strategy says split but do I want to lose another max bet?

At +1 and higher, you would surrender 8,8 vs 10.
If surrender is not available, if you are using the risk averse index, you would stand at +4 or greater. Otherwise, you should split.

[Thirdbaseman]

[QUOTE=seriousplayer;176014] There is no index deviation for 8's vs 9 using the Hi-lo count just play basic strategy.

You should surrender 8,8 vs 9 at +7 and higher.

[seriousplayer]

[QUOTE=Thirdbaseman;176027]

There is no index deviation for 8's vs 9 using the Hi-lo count just play basic strategy.

You should surrender 8,8 vs 9 at +7 and higher.

The AP mention in his first post that the game does not offer surrendering.

[seriousplayer]

Thanks serious player. Yes, I know the basic strategy answers. However, say the count goes TC+5, you have a max bet out, dealer has a 10 and you have 8,8. Basic strategy says split but do I want to lose another max bet? The odds, even when you split, are that you would lose both bets. Now, with a minimum bet out, in the long run, you would lose less by splitting. However, it's not often you get an 8,8 with a TC+5. Fact is that some pros do not split in such a situation, save one max bet.

i simply wanted to express that I have difficulty doing some of these splits with a max bet out. It's unfortunate that some, not you, with pent up hostilities and unable to masturbate, are waiting to take it out on some stranger on a forum.

For FYI splitting 8,8 vs 8 through Ace are defense splits. Splitting cut the disadvantage and lose.

[DSchles]

"However, say the count goes TC+5, you have a max bet out, dealer has a 10 and you have 8,8. Basic strategy says split but do I want to lose another max bet?"

We never want to lose any bets, but that doesn't mean that we don't make certain plays, if they're correct.

"The odds, even when you split, are that you would lose both bets."

That's not necessarily true and is probably false in this case. With the higher count, you are probably about 65% to lose one hand and 35% to win (exclude ties). So, to lose both hands is 42.25%, but to win one and lose one is 2 x 0.35 x 0.65 = 45.50%. You're more likely to break even than to lose both. Surprised? The problem is that you're very unlikely to win both, so your overall expectation is rather negative.

"Now, with a minimum bet out, in the long run, you would lose less by splitting."

You would also lose less with a maximum bet out, but you are risking more. So, you are correct that, from a risk-aversion point of view, there comes a point (right around +5!) above which splitting is no longer optimal. This is one of those times where you get the "right" answer for the "wrong" reason. Or, maybe you just have a good instinct as to when to make a risk-averse play!

"However, it's not often you get an 8,8 with a TC+5."

You get 8,8, vs. 10 once every 615 hands. The TC is greater than or equal to +5 about once every 36 hands. Ignoring any interaction between the two concepts, you get this holding once every 22,140 hands, or once every 221 hours! For some people, that represents an entire year's worth of play!! Bottom line: do whatever makes you happy.

"Fact is that some pros do not split in such a situation, to save one max bet."

Well, the first part may be true, but it isn't to "save one max bet." It's to forfeit a sliver of e.v. to save the greater variance on the play, by not splitting.

Don

[stopgambling]

If you can not do the right play because of your max bet ,then lower your stake. You are obviously afraid of losing money . Don't play a counting game or do other thing to invest your money that have a very low volatility.. I suggest you play at least half of your stake or even lower to make you feel safer about your money. You also do not seemed to trust the math of the game as you stated you can play with a higher stake with a low chance of busting but still is afraid of following index when called for.Maybe take the time to evaluate if you are suitable to play a bj counting game.

[Ryemo]

i simply wanted to express that I have difficulty doing some of these splits with a max bet out. It's unfortunate that some, not you, with pent up hostilities and unable to masturbate, are waiting to take it out on some stranger on a forum.

I'm not trying to bash on you Zee, so try to take this as constructive criticism. Any hostilities you encounter are self-inflicted. You constantly request the help of others while doing nothing to help yourself. If I were to pull up all of your past posts from both this site and BJ21, I'd be willing to bet that 90% of your questions could be answered simply by opening a book, using the aid of software, or simply ordering a copy of CBJN. You've stated in numerous posts that your BR is somewhere in the $30K to $40K range, yet you somehow can't afford software that costs $95, a blackjack news report that costs $15 for one month, or a replacement copy of BJA3 that costs $29.99 (because you lost your copy in a hotel apparently).

Even though Bodarc's post was clearly mocking you, there's some truth to his post. You refuse to purchase software or "get serious about BJ" until you retire, because you're afraid of what your family might think; yet, it seems like you spend a considerable amount of time in the casino AND trolling on these BJ sites. So what gives?

Bottom line, you show more signs of being a compulsive gambler vs an AP. You constantly post about how you neglect to follow basic strategy, execute certain index plays, or bet optimally based on your gut feelings or how much you've won/lost in a particular session. This is why I say maybe you should reconsider playing AP BJ. You want tips on splitting pairs? Learn your indices and execute them! There's no way it gets any simpler than that! If you're really concerned about the variance, then learn a set of RA indices. But I can tell you one thing; no pro is going to make a playing decision based on their gut feeling, unless it has something to do with diffusing heat. But that's a different topic. So that question of your's is basically pointless.

You've already lost all credibility on BJ21, which is why I assume you post there less frequently now. You'll most likely start to receive the same treatment here if you continue to act like a card counting ploppy who needs to be spoon fed everything. Buy some damn software, order another copy of BJA3, order a copy of CBJN, and quit polluting the boards with nonsense. If you do that, I suspect you'll see some of that "hostility" start to fade away. And I'm not trying to be disrespectful. Remember...this is just constructive criticism.