Bet Ramping

[seriousplayer]

Most betting strategies that I read in articles and book talks about how to bet optimally. I haven't found text on how to bet using bet ramping. I am interested in learning how to use bet ramp successfully. From how I understand bet ramping is I should up my bet after a win and not raise my bet after a loss. It occurs to me that by using bet ramping I might get up the slim advantage when used in shoe games. Is the method only for player whole play for big money and have a large bankroll?

Does anybody in this forum have any examples of a successful bet ramping technique?

[Norm]

Bet ramp refers to any method of relating the bet to the count. The method you are discussing is camouflage, designed to make you look more like a gambler. It reduces your advantage.

[seriousplayer]

Bet ramp refers to any method of relating the bet to the count. The method you are discussing is camouflage, designed to make you look more like a gambler. It reduces your advantage.

Norm, what method do you recommend for cover betting?

[Norm]

Very involved question. There a chapter in my book on the subject. But, it doesn't advise one method.

[seriousplayer]

Very involved question. There a chapter in my book on the subject. But, it doesn't advise one method.

I read the chapter in you book about cover betting the sad part is that most cover methods decrease the SCORE dramatically compare to no cover except for cover 6, which can turn a 1% advantage into only .5% advantage.

[Norm]

All cover methods decrease SCORE by definition.

[ZenMaster_Flash]

seriousplayer,

Optimal Betting is determined by computer.

However, a swift "back of the envelope" method looks like this:

1. Take a realistic look at your bankroll.
2. If you aren't willing to lose X dollars it is NOT a bankroll.
3. Understand your Risk of Ruin to determine how low your bets must be.
4. Determine the House Edge (accurately).
5. Note the average Penetration depth.
6. Know the advantage that you gain/lose by each digit of T.C.
7. Set your Max Bet at approximately a 2% advantage.
8. Ramp downwards from there, trying not to create excess levels.
9. Round Off all bets to the closest EVEN amount.

IF the game is dealt shallow you may drop your Max Bet to 1.5%

[Freightman]

Most betting strategies that I read in articles and book talks about how to bet optimally. I haven't found text on how to bet using bet ramping. I am interested in learning how to use bet ramp successfully. From how I understand bet ramping is I should up my bet after a win and not raise my bet after a loss. It occurs to me that by using bet ramping I might get up the slim advantage when used in shoe games. Is the method only for player whole play for big money and have a large bankroll?

Does anybody in this forum have any examples of a successful bet ramping technique?

Am guessing you are fairly new to this. There are programs to calculate these things and which also allow for variable type input. What's your bankroll in dollars - what is min and max bet allowed - what is your count system - what are the rules of your game and what us deck penetration. From this info, an optimal bet ramp can be shown, and your EV can be calculated. Upping your bet and staying the same or reducing after a loss will certainly reduce your EV, and these dollar amounts can also be calculated. Depending on your stakes, the cover you have suggested may not even be worthwhile.

[ZeeBabar]

I prefer to bet according to count. This is what I aim for. For example, 1 unit for TC at 0 or below, 2 units at TC 1, 3 units at TC2, etc. in places where I am rated, like my small local casino where heat is negligible, the rules are bad (the casino probably feels the rules will keep them safe) and the pit calls the shots, I use no cover and play exactly as count dictates, always start show with 1 unit. Ofcourse, my max bet is only $200 at DD games and 2x$150 in shoe games. I also leave with a win under $1k.

in other places, I only ocassionally mix it up so there is no clear pattern but not by much. Maybe I start a shoe or a DD game with two hands or sometimes with one hand of 2 units, but no major patterns like the OP states. Often this varies by how much I feel my game is being scrutinized. If I ever move up in stakes, or play extensively while unrated, I might have to learn other things.

i think that people playing at red chip or low green chips should never even think about heat and such things unless they have had their first back off. To often, while new, we think we are doing something wrong ( like shop lifting) and we start looking for heat and it effects our game.

[seriousplayer]

Am guessing you are fairly new to this. There are programs to calculate these things and which also allow for variable type input. What's your bankroll in dollars - what is min and max bet allowed - what is your count system - what are the rules of your game and what us deck penetration. From this info, an optimal bet ramp can be shown, and your EV can be calculated. Upping your bet and staying the same or reducing after a loss will certainly reduce your EV, and these dollar amounts can also be calculated. Depending on your stakes, the cover you have suggested may not even be worthwhile.

I usually bet proportional to the count. As for program does CVDATA does those calculation if not than what program does it for me?

[Stealth]

I usually bet proportional to the count. As for program does CVDATA does those calculation if not than what program does it for me?

Norm's product CVCX will answer your questions about bet ramping. Optimal or otherwise and allow you to experiment with various structures.

[bigplayer]

Cover betting...know the casino's freakout point and keep your bet below that point as long as possible. Then run sims on everything to check on the cost.

[Tarzan]

Bigplayer is right, there's a difference between optimal bet ramping and feasible bet ramping for a specific location.