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Thread: Is This Cheatinf at Dice?

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    Is This Cheatinf at Dice?

    The uninformed crew working the crap game allow you to make a late Don't Pass bet after the point has been established.

    Would you consider this cheating?

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    Technically yes.

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    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    Also legally. Nevada 465.070.5 Fraudulent acts. It is unlawful for any person: To place or increase a bet after acquiring knowledge of the outcome of the game or other event which is the subject of the bet, including past-posting and pressing bets.
    "I don't think outside the box; I think of what I can do with the box." - Henri Matisse

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    But if they are knowingly allowing you to place the bet, how is it cheating? It's not like you are deceiving them. It's right in front of them!

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    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    The law says nothing about deception. If they allow this knowingly, they are also guilty of the crime.
    "I don't think outside the box; I think of what I can do with the box." - Henri Matisse

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    Quote Originally Posted by WABJ11 View Post
    "But if they are knowingly allowing you to place the bet, how is it cheating? It's not like you are deceiving them. It's right in front of them!"
    This is dangerously close to the false argument that if I
    leave my car unlocked then a thief is not guilty of stealing it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WABJ11 View Post
    The uninformed crew working the crap game allow you to make a late Don't Pass bet after the point has been established.

    Would you consider this cheating?

    Different states/regulating committees, different rules .

    Example: one of my home stores lets you post the pass line after the point has been established (increases the HE). Another place you must have your pass line wager placed prior to the come out roll/point being established.
    There is no glory in practice, but without practice there is no glory . -Unknown

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    Their not supposed to accept the bet from what I understand after the point has been established, I would not consider it cheating. But it would probably depend on how long it took the player to make the Don't Pass bet after the point was established. If it's a second or two after the point is established and the dice are in the middle of the table the dealers may or may not turn a players bet down, especially if they determine it's the players minimum bet. It's really up the dealer working the table and what he or she will allow the player to get away with. Stuff like this happens all the time at craps tables.

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    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    Clearly you can have different rules. But, you can't break the rules. As for making a pass bet after the point is made -- the casino should suggest you move it to a come bet.
    "I don't think outside the box; I think of what I can do with the box." - Henri Matisse

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    The dealers will let something like this slip, it's really no biggie unless the player is making a Don't Pass bet 3 rolls after the point has been established, now that is WAY late and should not be accepted. If the dealer books the bet no sweat, if they don't then it's no big deal. They should suggest you move to a Come bet or they should place the players chip on the back line indicating that the player is placing the point. But since the OP mentioned it's a Don't Pass bet, the bet should be moved to the Don't Come.
    Last edited by Blitzkrieg; 10-22-2015 at 10:00 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Norm View Post
    Clearly you can have different rules. But, you can't break the rules. As for making a pass bet after the point is made -- the casino should suggest you move it to a come bet.
    Just like casinos should say, double down, split, and surrender certain hands .. But, unfortunately they don't . I witnessed a dealer tell a guy last night that the match the dealer bonus was a "for sure" win "at least" 1 out of every 3 hands .. $1500 bucks later he was still chasing those matches . Meanwhile, I got prob 5-10 perfect matches and didn't play it once . Lol.
    There is no glory in practice, but without practice there is no glory . -Unknown

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blitzkrieg View Post
    Their not supposed to accept the bet from what I understand after the point has been established, I would not consider it cheating. But it would probably depend on how long it took the player to make the Don't Pass bet after the point was established. If it's a second or two after the point is established and the dice are in the middle of the table the dealers may or may not turn a players bet down, especially if they determine it's the players minimum bet. It's really up the dealer working the table and what he or she will allow the player to get away with. Stuff like this happens all the time at craps tables.
    They could take the bet and refuse to pay it if it won because it was an illegal bet. You would here, "We could get a huge fine for paying an illegal bet" or "Our superiors don't know there is no collision we could get fired for paying it". Past posting bets is illegal whether they book the bet or not. Before the dice leave a players hand they call no more bets, usually they call no more bets before the player gets the dice. A bet can be booked by an answer of "bet" from the boxman or dealer while the dice are in the air but once they hit the table they are not supposed to call 'Bet" but rather "no bet" should be the call. I would suspect after a casino lost 1.5 million on a past posting collusion at the dice tables that they would be even more strict about these kinds of things.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blitzkrieg View Post
    "Their not supposed to accept the bet from what I understand after the point has been established, I would not consider it cheating".
    NOTE: A "HOP BET" can be made on every roll and at any time.

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