More toleration is afforded to wonging out.
Not sure I understand your post, Stopgambling, in my reference to $100, it wasn't as to a maximum bet....it was as to SCORE's definition (or how I thought it to be) and correlating it to ZenFlash's "annual income" analogy. His analogy just helps me understand more in "layman's terms" without use of computer programming, the expected money or return at a certain score. I just always understood score as an hourly rate of return dollar wise per $100 bet. Am I wrong?Originally Posted by stopgambling
I think Zen was just telling me that you also have to assume a $10k bankroll approx, too, with Kelly betting.
"Women and cats will do as they please, and Men and dogs should just relax and get used to the idea" --- Robert A. Heinlein
Your question is a lot like a beginning poker player asking if he should have called the river bet in a tournament without giving any info on how the entire hand played out, relative stack sizes of all players, observed playing tendencies, etc. You are asking about one aspect, in isolation, of a very complex decision making process.
Here are my questions when considering whether I want to play at a given casino. Every "yes" answer makes the game more playable.
Is the game set up well for the amounts I want to bet (table min/maxes and casino tolerance thresholds apply here)?
Is the game easy to get to in terms of time and expense?
Are the rules good (initial house edge of less than .5% for shoes and .25% for pitch)?
Does the casino offer Surrender?
Is the penetration good (80%+ for shoes, 65%+ for pitch)?
Are the dealers prone to mistakes?
Are the dealers fast?
Is the casino likely to have uncrowded tables for me to play?
Are there other games that might interest me at the casino destination?
Is there likely to be at least one bigger player at the BJ tables? The more whales the better.
Am I welcome at this casino (no prior backoffs or 86ing under my real name, at a minimum)?
Are the comps good (assumes I am able to play rated, of course)?
Is playing this game going to bring me more utility than the next best use of my time? If the alternative is a blowjob from Kate Upton it better be one hell of a game...... I have an interesting poker story about a guy who folded pocket aces preflop in a $2/$4 limit game that is along these lines. I believe he made the right play.
In general, I consider all these questions. But one "yes" answer may be enough, if it is significant enough. One "no" answer may also be enough to exclude the casino from consideration, if it is significant enough.
"Is the penetration good (80%+ for shoes, 65%+ for pitch)?"
if if the penetration meets the above requirements, would you play the game even if the rules are not do good?
6 deck, H17, no Surrender, all other rules standard.
2Deck, double 9-11, H 17, no RSA, no double after splits.
if if the penetration meets the above requirements, would you play the game even if the rules are not do good?
6 deck, H17, no Surrender, all other rules standard.
2Deck, double 9-11, H 17, no RSA, no double after splits.
[/COLOR][/QUOTE]
The DD game is -.81. The shoe game is -.61.
I could care less about surrender.. I care about casinos taking action.. you want to cut off 2 decks and s17 fine,, shuffle and deal ill play.. as long as they take bets that's what matters.. the splitting to 2 hands only scores the game kind of crappy but watrv.. I rather play a big max game then a 300 max early surrender game.. what casinos do you think is going to let you win more actually real dollars?
Look at it this way. Casino A has a game SCORE 60 at the spread acceptable to the casino but you can only play 2 hours before they kick you out because they are super sharp and any spreading is counted down by the EITS. A lot of vegas games are like this except replace 2 hours with 30 minutes. Casino B has a game SCORE 30 at the spread acceptable to the casino and you can play as long as you want. I am defining "spread acceptable to the casino" as "if you try to spread more than this you will be barred almost immediately".
Casino A you can make $60 * your bankroll / $10000 betting full kelly for 2 hours. Let's say your bankroll is 100k so you can make $1200 in EV off this game. But you have to spend 4 hours round trip traveling to this game. Your EV is then $1200 / 6 hours or $200 an hour. Casino B let's say you play two days in a row 20 hours total. Your EV is $6000, hourly EV is $6000/ 24 which is something like $275 an hour. When you consider travel costs Casino B will be by far the more profitable game even on an hourly rate basis. Plus you are getting EV whereas in the Casino A case you have to travel to another casino. It is true the swings will be higher in the Casino B game. The solution is to be over bankrolled and grind it out. Plus the casino B game, if they really don't care you can probably play rated and get some comps for your play.
Last edited by biggg; 10-23-2015 at 11:29 AM.
Let's further assume that you are in town for a conference and only have two hours available to play BJ for your trip. Casino A then "wins".
The correct answer, as always, is "it depends". The answer of which is better will be different for different AP's.
Funny timing you came in here with that comment. I just listened to your GWAE program and thought that was truthfully the gist and "brass tacks" of the show........only play the places that let you put the action YOU want in play. Otherwise rules aside, game may not be worth your time. El Cortez sweatshop good rules v. Bellagio/Ceasars' "ho humm" bet levels, who cares? (OK, may not be the best choice but I think I understand the gist). What I have learned is that getting the action that I am willing to risk INTO play is the top question. Here (our jurisdiction) for example...........small cap wouldn't play...unless he could get a private, special table. Limits too small BUT at those limits, you can spread wildly and "blend in" with the other gamblers. SO......that game is playable to me.
And Bigg makes a similar observation that makes sense to me, too. I'm really trying to get a handle on our environment for playing with good rules.........but lack of options.......v. traveling to find better rules and conditions IF they readily exist. I'm not sure they are but that is SO dependent upon each person's actual BETTING level.
Last edited by MJGolf; 10-23-2015 at 12:59 PM.
"Women and cats will do as they please, and Men and dogs should just relax and get used to the idea" --- Robert A. Heinlein
I play that game all the time, tablehopping with Pontoon, spreading 1-2x8 maxing out at TC of 6... theoretical ev of 40+/hr. Minimal heat.
Although I guess the Sword of Damocles forever hangs over me.
I.... feel so right doing the Wong thing!!! 9-5! 9-5! 9-5! Every king that screws her makes me feel alive!!
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