Bankroll vs rules

[cjjellie]

Hi everyone. I'm new to the forum, and have enjoyed reading all of your posts. I'm hoping you can give me some advice.

I played blackjack for the first time in my life about six months ago, and loved it. I have memorized basic strategy and can count Hi Lo accurately. For the past six months, I've averaged just under $300 a week playing two to three times at my local casino, red and sometimes green, with a small bankroll. My family jokes that BJ is my second job, and I kind of view it that way as well.

My real job is sending us to Vegas for a weekend conference. I'm smart enough to know that I may be a good player here, but not so much there. I also don't have a huge bankroll. That said, I would LOVE to play with some great rules. The house edge here is about .56, but it's the only casino within three hours. The better tables in Vegas, however, have higher limits which would impact my ability to spread my bets. Also, I'm worried that I may misplay the better rules anyway, like forgetting surrender. I have started practicing on sims with the "new" rules, but who knows what I'd do in a live environment.

So, what's more impactful--bank roll or house edge? I'd hate to have this free trip and not play, but I'd also hate to go and not play well.

Thanks for your thoughts.

CJ

[Freightman]

Hi everyone. I'm new to the forum, and have enjoyed reading all of your posts. I'm hoping you can give me some advice.

I played blackjack for the first time in my life about six months ago, and loved it. I have memorized basic strategy and can count Hi Lo accurately. For the past six months, I've averaged just under $300 a week playing two to three times at my local casino, red and sometimes green, with a small bankroll. My family jokes that BJ is my second job, and I kind of view it that way as well.

My real job is sending us to Vegas for a weekend conference. I'm smart enough to know that I may be a good player here, but not so much there. I also don't have a huge bankroll. That said, I would LOVE to play with some great rules. The house edge here is about .56, but it's the only casino within three hours. The better tables in Vegas, however, have higher limits which would impact my ability to spread my bets. Also, I'm worried that I may misplay the better rules anyway, like forgetting surrender. I have started practicing on sims with the "new" rules, but who knows what I'd do in a live environment.

So, what's more impactful--bank roll or house edge? I'd hate to have this free trip and not play, but I'd also hate to go and not play well.

Thanks for your thoughts.

CJ

Many thoughts in no particular order. firstly, don't think of yourself as a good player, at home, and maybe not good enough for Vegas. You are either good or not good based on your experience. - for now, it's good that you have picked up some skills, but please understand, at this apparent stage of development, you still have lots to learn. It's good that you have some money, though u are suggesting that your bankroll is limited. Don't try to set the world on fire, especially if thoughts on your bankroll size is correct. If your roll us limited, cheaper mins can be found downtown. Also, off strip locals places will be of value as well - such as Stations casinos. The strip places with low mins will clobber you with the 6:5 crap.

Are you familiar with concepts such as Kelly betting, risk of ruin etc. Let us know your bankroll size - we can likely further advise on other matters, such as books, software, cheaper limits with decent rules etc.

[nwkfern69]

Yes freight-man is right. There are very few casinos that offer good games less than a quarter min if any on the strip. Stations and downtown is a better place to find quality games for as low as nickel minimums. Good luck!!!

[cjjellie]

Thank you for the replies! I am familiar with Kelly betting and risk vs ruin in an academic sense... As for my skills, I would say I'm solid at the table, but know next to nothing about bankroll management, or appropriate bet spread. I am lucky that I look like a ploppie, and I've been able to get away with back counting two tables while my husband plays craps. I can then mosey over and play a few hands when the count is good. This way, I don't have to worry about bet spread or ramping.

Someday I'd like to make money doing this. I love the game, and because of that reason alone, I'd love to play with some good player odds. My bankroll, though, is $1500 tops. I haven't put any effort into building one, and that's what I'm comfortable losing. So a few bad hands, and I'm done.

I doubt I'll get to go off strip, but I will make the effort. I did check out the latest CJBN and found some decent .40 games on the strip. Still, it sucks to eat hamburger when there's filet next door. Don't worry, I'll never play 6:5.

If nothing else, having this opportunity and not being able to capitalize on it has made me serious about building a real bankroll. So far I've used my "second job" for a new dishwasher, front door, washer and dryer...lol The $1500 I do have was earmarked for a bathroom remodel.

[Bodarc]

So a few bad hands, and I'm done.

Hi cjjellie

26 wks X 300 = $7,800 + say $200 to start = $ 8.000. You only have $1,500 left out of that. If you don't start building your bankroll, you will surely be 'done' the first streak of bad variance you hit. If you really enjoy playing, you must refrain from spending your winnings and build a bankroll you can fall back on. You have been very lucky so far.
One thing is for certain though, they'll never take your dishwasher, front door and washer/dryer from you.

[CallSaul]

Thank you for the replies! I am familiar with Kelly betting and risk vs ruin in an academic sense... As for my skills, I would say I'm solid at the table, but know next to nothing about bankroll management, or appropriate bet spread. I am lucky that I look like a ploppie, and I've been able to get away with back counting two tables while my husband plays craps. I can then mosey over and play a few hands when the count is good. This way, I don't have to worry about bet spread or ramping.

Someday I'd like to make money doing this. I love the game, and because of that reason alone, I'd love to play with some good player odds. My bankroll, though, is $1500 tops. I haven't put any effort into building one, and that's what I'm comfortable losing. So a few bad hands, and I'm done.

I doubt I'll get to go off strip, but I will make the effort. I did check out the latest CJBN and found some decent .40 games on the strip. Still, it sucks to eat hamburger when there's filet next door. Don't worry, I'll never play 6:5.

If nothing else, having this opportunity and not being able to capitalize on it has made me serious about building a real bankroll. So far I've used my "second job" for a new dishwasher, front door, washer and dryer...lol The $1500 I do have was earmarked for a bathroom remodel.

Hi, I was recently in Las Vegas and found a handful of decent $10 and $15 games on the strip. Also, there are $5 games downtown and near the strip. Of course, as others have said, there are better low limit games further out. (Caveat: I mostly played shoe games on this trip, so my observations and recommendations mostly relate to those.)

With your bankroll, I'd recommend sticking with $5 games. Now, most of the $5 games are going to have mediocre rules (H17, but usually DS and sometimes LS). At your bankroll, I'd rather play a $5 game with those rules and good pen than a $25 S17 game.

Good job checking out CBJN. It's a good resource, but not 100% accurate (at least in part because conditions are constantly changing). Feel free to PM me or email me ([email protected]) if you would like some more detailed observations from my red-chipping trip to Las Vegas.

[Orangechip2]

Hi cjjellie

26 wks X 300 = $7,800 + say $200 to start = $ 8.000. You only have $1,500 left out of that. If you don't start building your bankroll, you will surely be 'done' the first streak of bad variance you hit. If you really enjoy playing, you must refrain from spending your winnings and build a bankroll you can fall back on. You have been very lucky so far.
One thing is for certain though, they'll never take your dishwasher, front door and washer/dryer from you.

+1

if you ever want to build a semi decent roll only for BJ do as Bodarc describes above - this is very solid advise and shouldn't just be skimmed over . Think in terms of investing opposed to any other frame of mind you may have previously had. Build a sufficient roll where you can determine a "Max Bet" and then don't play BJ until you have 30-40 max bets - any other approach I think you bust your roll and you'd more than likely be discouraged . As they usually say, don't learn just enough to get yourself in trouble: You mentioned hi low and bs - know what your getting yourself into before taking on the objective .

[Freightman]

I

+1

if you ever want to build a semi decent roll only for BJ do as Bodarc describes above - this is very solid advise and shouldn't just be skimmed over . Think in terms of investing opposed to any other frame of mind you may have previously had. Build a sufficient roll where you can determine a "Max Bet" and then don't play BJ until you have 30-40 max bets - any other approach I think you bust your roll and you'd more than likely be discouraged . As they usually say, don't learn just enough to get yourself in trouble: You mentioned hi low and bs - know what your getting yourself into before taking on the objective .

Might be an idea of looking at this as a replenishable bankroll for now. She has taken apparently no money for herself, referring to invest about 6300 into her house, on goods that may not be in the budget, or that the hub didn't want to pay for. No doubt this approach will sooner or later decimate her remaining 1500, which she has stated, she is prepared to lose.

When she loses it, hubby should be grateful that he didn't have to spend.6300 making OP happy, and should consider himself lucky just to replenish the original roll.

Now, once OP learns a couple of fundamental ROR issues, she can slow down the renovations, taking some smaller percentage for goodies for the house. Now, if she wants to get serious about some heavy duty house purchases, reinvesting total profits as outlined by OC, is the way to go, so she can get out of that $5 min crap and hopefully get herself into some better games.

[ZenMaster_Flash]

CallSaul,

You said: " ... most of the $5 games are going to have mediocre rules (H17, but usually DS and sometimes LS). At your bankroll, I'd rather play a $5 game with those rules and good pen than a $25 S17 game."

I have yet to see LS at any $5 tables in L.V. - not that I pay attention to low stakes games.
$25 S17 games are becoming rare, but UNDOUBTEDLY, the O.P. cannot afford green action.

[CallSaul]

CallSaul,

You said: " ... most of the $5 games are going to have mediocre rules (H17, but usually DS and sometimes LS). At your bankroll, I'd rather play a $5 game with those rules and good pen than a $25 S17 game."

I have yet to see LS at any $5 tables in L.V. - not that I pay attention to low stakes games.

Palace Station offers LS on their $5 6D games...or at least they did when I was last in LV (a few weeks ago).

[cjjellie]

You're all right, of course, and I appreciate the feedback.

This BJ thing started as a lark. We went to Vegas for vacation, and my husband bought me a basic strategy card and went to play craps. At the table, I noticed the guy to my left always seemed to win big and lose small. I started following his bets, and lo and behold, I also won big and lost small. I went home determined to figure out how he knew what to bet.

I didn't go back to a casino until I mastered basic strategy, and I *thought* I had mastered counting. I didn't lose a lot, but I lost enough for me to get serious, buy some software and really practice. Since then, I've done alright.

I didn't consider a bankroll because I felt I really didn't need one. I used BJ to as a second job. Recently, I've considered what I could do if I built a bankroll vs just using my winnings as income, so I started saving towards that. Then this freebie trip came along...

In reality, I could lose more than $1500. I just don't want to.

Again, thank you for your great advice. I've enjoyed this forum so far, and have learned a lot.

[Orangechip2]

Cj . In the future if you find yourself at a table with another advantage player unless you two are playing together don't stay at their table, and more importantly don't shadow their bets .

I look forward to your experiences.

[cjjellie]

Hi OP,

I'm sure that's good advice, as you clearly are more experienced than I am. Why, though? Too much attention? To be fair, I was checking my card after each deal, so I was probably in the clear.