Difference In Index #'s Between Prof BJ and I-18

[Casino Kid]

Hi. This is my first post so I have many questions, but I recently saw Norm say that it's better to limit it to one per thread to get better discussion so I'll keep it to this.

I recently got copies of Prof BJ and BJA and saw that Don and Wong have different index #'s listed for some of the plays. Is this strictly a function of Don using 4 decks vs. 6 decks for Wong, or are there other factors involved like number of hands simulated, different calculation methods, etc? I made a chart based on Wong's 6D H17 #'s - aside from 4 decks I couldn't find any other assumptions listed in the I-18 chapter of BJA but I'm guessing it was for S17, but even so I think that there were some differences from Wong's S17 #'s as well. Has the I-18 simply become the standard over Wong's indices or does it depend on the game you're playing?

If this information helps I'm not going to have the opportunity to play a lot any time soon due to work schedule and location, so I'm not making a career out of this right now, but when I play I want to give myself the best chance to win. I've had a couple of profitable evenings playing BS, but I know it's generally a losing proposition and I want to do better than that.

Side note: I know that H17 is discouraged but I feel like I'm much more likely to run into it. Between Fremont St, Strip, East Vegas, and Central City/Black Hawk, CO I strolled through about 30 casinos and don't recall seeing any shoe games with S17 and it's safe to assume that the rules aren't going to get more favorable.

[KJ]

This has been discussed on this and other sites a good deal. It shouldn't be very difficult for you to do a little research. But maybe Don (or someone) will weigh in and explain it again. But all you really need to know, is that the difference is meaningless. What ever difference there is will amount to pennies, even at higher betting levels.

You would be better off to direct your focus elsewhere.

[Casino Kid]

But all you really need to know, is that the difference is meaningless. What ever difference there is will amount to pennies, even at higher betting levels.

That's what I needed. Thank you.

[DSchles]

The index numbers in the I18 chapter of BJA3 are taken directly from Wong! See footnote 7 on page 62. If, ironically, some of those indices differ from those found in later versions of Wong's own book, it's because Wong himself changed his methodology for generating indices, which he explains at the top of p. 254 of Pro BJ.

Finally, the indices supplied on p. 213 of BJA3 postdate all of the above and are, for all intents and purposes, the most accurate you will find in print for Hi-Lo. They are floored and were generated by Norm Wattenberger.

Hope this helps. Welcome aboard!

Don

[MJGolf]

Casino Kid...you might also take a look at Snyder's writings on Hi Lo Lite on BJForum online AND Blackbelt in Blackjack (his book) as to what he writes about small differences in indexes, also. Research on this board will reflect the opinion that a minor index number difference is very meaningless in the overall scale of things.

[Casino Kid]

I found a very cheap (like cheaper than the shipping) version of BJA2 on Amazon so I went with that. Perhaps that's the source of some of the discrepancies. Was there much change between the second and third editions? Thanks for your reply

[DSchles]

"I found a very cheap (like cheaper than the shipping) version of BJA2 on Amazon so I went with that."

You don't have BJA3???

"Perhaps that's the source of some of the discrepancies."

No, it isn't.

"Was there much change between the second and third editions?"

The third edition is twice the size of the second.

"Thanks for your reply."

Get BJA3. :-)

Don

[max85]

edited

[Thirdbaseman]

I found a very cheap (like cheaper than the shipping) version of BJA2 on Amazon so I went with that. Perhaps that's the source of some of the discrepancies. Was there much change between the second and third editions? Thanks for your reply

PBJ is a good 1st book.
But if you want to learn counting, you must have BJA3.

[Casino Kid]

Very good, you've all convinced me. My copy is on the way.

[Casino Kid]

Also, I know this topic has been covered many times, but since this thread is already the top and for the benefit of new posters/lurkers, are there any other essential book recommendations and maybe a brief explanation of what each one adds to the arsenal?

[Avincow]

Burning the Tables in Las Vegas by Ian Anderson is a very good book about cover.

[Zach Black]

Burning the Tables in Las Vegas by Ian Anderson is a very good book about cover.

For a black chip min player. A waste of money for lower minimum bets.