getting better PE and IC without giving up BC How much is too much?

[moses]

Delete

[Three]

You have to run a sim for your bet ramp or BR and RoR wit optimal bet ramp. EV is the interaction of the three metrics, BC, PE and IC. Having the highest of all 3 as an option doesn't guarantee the highest EV. PE is calculated for flat betting. BC relates to bet variation. you can win lots of your little best for a high PE but lose more bigger bets to have a very high PE and BC. That isn't going to help your EV. You play SD so the interaction between BC and PE will be quite different than a spread used in a shoe game.

[Three]

For the limited spread you can get away with at SD PE is more important. Of course you have posted that you are too cautious to make deviations when called for sometimes. Insurance is the only thing that is linear in BJ. SCORE tells the story for comparing systems. That is what Don invented it for.

My current system comes with the highest SCORE and EV. Perhaps because it does best on large bets. But the BC,PE, IC are weak by comparison.

Like I said the highest BC, PE and IC isn't necessarily the best choice as your SCORE and EV clearly show.

[DSchles]

You don't need e.v.; it's wrapped up in SCORE. Optimal bet size is e.v./var. Optimal bet times e.v. gives SCORE; i.e., SCORE = e.v.^2/var.

No other metric matters except SCORE. In the old days, people used to compare e.v.s, BC, PE, and IC. As Tthree has properly told you, none of them matters, in and of itself. All that matters is how they interact once you bet optimally, to produce a SCORE.

Don

[stopgambling]

And the insurance bet will put you at risk for a BO and decrease pen. It is what you can get away with.

[moo321]

And the insurance bet will put you at risk for a BO and decrease pen. It is what you can get away with.

What?

[Three]

You know you can take partial insurance. Seeming to take insurance at random times for random amounts is great for cover. Of course you know exactly how much you put out if you have some of your chips organized. If your choice is pass up your best index play or water it down a little it is a no brainer which is the better choice. Last time I felt I had to throw out some off the top cover insurance bets I won both of them. Playing like a computer makes you easy to spot especially with a single parameter ace reckoned count. Insurance and index plays always made at certain bets or higher. Of course with SD play the count is so volatile between betting and playing decisions this isn't true as frequently. There becomes a necessity to throw in some low cost deception in sweatier joints or dealers. Complicated approaches can have enough difference between betting count and playing count to make this less necessary but deception is still wise at appropriate times. If the crew is clueless you are just throwing away money so having the skill to discern what is required in any given situation helps both EV and longevity.

[DSchles]

In that case the Silver Fox count has a much higher SCORE than Wong Halves for my betting ramp or any other halves scenario so far.

Your answer makes no sense and shows that you don't understand the concept. If bet optimally (your personal ramp is irrelevant), Wong's Halves will always outperform Silver Fox by an appreciable margin. How would you expect a level-1 count that is actually inferior to Hi-Lo to outperform a level-3 count?

You don't understand the concepts.

Don

[DSchles]

Actually, I forgot that you play only single-deck, because, well, no serious player playing for high stakes and straight card counting plays SD. So, I have to amend my answer; Wong's Halves will still outperform, but not by nearly as much as for multi-deck, with large spreads, where it will crush Silver Fox.

Don

[DSchles]

It is relevant to me. I just key in the numbers and the SCORE is the score. I have no problem with switching...I'd like to improve. But sim's suggest staying put....and it's not even close.

Then you're doing something wrong with the sims. GIGO. Make very sure that you aren't quoting just any old hourly win rate, but a genuine SCORE. I trust you understand the difference between the two. It would take a terribly contrived scenario for Silver Fox to outperform Halves.

Don

[DSchles]

You have to be kidding.

Don

[Three]

FIgured out GIGO. Session length is 100 hands. BR $500. Target is $750. for both.

You can't sim like this. Life is one giant session. Stop trying to get an answer to session results which is meaningless statistically speaking. That is because anything can happen in the short run. Target and session length aren't relevant and shouldn't be considered at all when comparing what is better.

[Three]

SCORE is a standard as Don used it . $10K BR, full kelly (13.5% RoR), 10:1 spread. You can get a Score for your game or other parameters for your own comparison as you would want. Just keep the parameters the same for both counts and let the computer pick the optimal ramp. You might do your SD rules and pen, $10K BR, 5% RoR, 3:1 spread with optimal bets generated by the computer for the BR and RoR. That will give results that have all the difference show up as SCORE differences. Sims need to be millions of hands. Session length and target is irrelevant. That is a fair comparison that will give accurate results. SCORE is equal to 1,000,000/N0. So the N0 from this comparison can be used to calculate the SCORE if you don't see a SCORE.