Ace5 and Spanish 21

[Nikky_Flash]

I would think , with all the weird conditional plays in that game, the easiest possible count would be ideal

[Nikky_Flash]

That is not the case but the easiest and still very effective may be +1,+1,+1,+1,+1,0,0,0,-1,-2. It has a reasonable PE and BC. You can do a lot better though.

Going the wrong way. For a level 1 ace reckoned: J,Q,K,A -1. 3,4,5,6 +1. I've seen 4-7 done for higher PE. You can add the 9 and 2 or 7. For higher BC you want a multilevel with the ace counted as -2 or even -3. You can balance the extra by making the 5 counted +2. If you can keep a balanced side count for betting have the higher low cards in the main count and balance the A with the lower cards or if you can handle an overlap in 2 balanced counts you can have the 5 and 4 be in both counts. This is where all the keep it simple BJ counters must learn new skills to really make the most of another game. The rewards are well worth the effort in this game.

Cool, very good info - thank you

[biggg]

Indexes are very important in Spanish 21, more so than in regular BJ. Unfortunately without using an ace side count most counts which are strong for BC will have horrible PE and vice versa. All below refers to the S17 game with no redoubling.

I used to use Hi-Lo, with aces counted as -2. I think this is a very solid count that while not the strongest for PE would be easy for a blackjack player to step in and learn. With this count I was getting SCOREs just below 20 (unfortunately I am quoting these numbers by memory) with a typical cut of 1.5 decks and 1-12 spread play all one hand only, with SCORE perhaps 25-28 after wonging out in bad counts. This is with full indices for 2-4 cards and basic strat above that although I used an estimate for 3-4 cards since I couldn't figure out how to sim them. With spreading to two hands and a more aggressive spread, which I have used with no problems in the past (getting a S17 spanish table with two adjacent spots is more difficult than spreading say 25 to 500 IMO) the SCORE could be pushed up above 40.

I now use the count 1,1,2,2,1,1,-1,-1,-1,-3. Counting the seven as +1 is not optimal and ignoring it and counting the three as +2 would be better. But I find this count is much easier to use at the tables because all the cards are counted. I get a SCORE of 27 in the same conditions as the A -2 count, moving into the mid 30s after wonging. To me this is not really worth playing as there are plenty of BJ games better than that, but I think Spanish is fun and very low heat, so it's something I do when I feel like having a relaxing recreational session. I will not name casinos but there is at least one casino where if I play rated I will get a normal treatment regardless of play style in Spanish whereas I am not able to play rated BJ in that casino. With that said I have been backed off playing Spanish. I am not certain but I believe the comps are much better in this game than regular BJ (they should be) as well.

[Three]

I now use the count 1,1,2,2,1,1,-1,-1,-1,-3.

The trick is to have your playing decisions made with and ace neutral count and your betting decisions be the combination of 2 counts that total to something like this. It takes some real counting skillz that are poopooed in BJ circles today. Unfortunately that means most BJ players are ill suited to this game unless they develop real counting chops that they don't use in BJ.

[Jabberwocky]

The faces are pretty minor cards for betting. The ace and 5 followed by the 4 are the big drivers in advantage. If few aces have been seen you should be ramping your bet most of the time. Look at the betting EORs in order of magnitude of the cards worth counting in the S17 game:
A: -1.28
5: +.96
4: +.80
6: +.56
3: +.56
T: -.48
2: +.40
9: -.25

As you can see the ace is by far the driver of advantage and the 5 and to lesser degree 4 are also big drivers. The face cards are fairly minor. The 9 is usually thrown in for count balance for playing and betting. It really has little value for betting. One five seen balances 2 face cards exactly. Two 4's more than balance 3 faces. Five 3's and/or 6's exactly balance six faces. A table mostly covered in paint might increase your advantage if no aces and some 5's and/or 4's are out there. As you can see the minus cards are all at the bottom of the column except for the ace which is the UBER card supreme for betting. Those top 2 cards in the chart explain exactly why the Ace-5 count works better than in BJ.

Why could you not employ a balanced secondary count such as 4s, 5s = +1 and Aces = -2 with the balanced main count? Is it because it would have little effect on playing efficiencies?

[Three]

That would work well. The main count for playing and the combined count for betting and doubling 10 and 9.

[ayjacks]

nvr55xx would you run the same sim for me? except make it h17.

[Jabberwocky]

Why could you not employ a balanced secondary count such as 4s, 5s = +1 and Aces = -2 with the balanced main count? Is it because it would have little effect on playing efficiencies?

I use this arrangement except ALL counts are unbalanced.

[ZenMaster_Flash]

Jabberwocky ...

... may use an unbalanced count, but I wouldn't; as I cannot justify the inherent inaccuracy.

Important factoid: It is true, that, in general, heat is low at Span21, BUT if you are already

in a casino's surveillance database you will be "auto-86'd" at Span21.

It has happened to me a few times. Limit your bets so as to not approach the table maximum

bet which is generally $500 on the East Coast and $300 on the North West Coast.