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Laughlin Marauder: Re: One more question
> ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
> I know exactly what you mean. Thats the
> thing I have to consider. But I haven't a
> problem in the world finding a 3-5 or 10
> dollar table. I have yet to sit at a green
> chip table. I have fantasies of it. But when
> I walk by one I just smile and
> think.."one day Kid...One Day...".
> The most I have ever won on a single hand
> was around 80 dollars. Due to splitting
> doubling etc..
> But 25 minimum is but a dream for me right
> now.
> Thats why I am attempting to grind out a 20
> dollar an hour win. It doesnt sound like a
> lot. But it adds up quick. Once I boost my
> bank at 20 an hour I would give my self a
> raise to maybe 25 - 30 dollars an hour.
> Granted it will be a grind.
> But it is a million times better than what I
> do day to day now. So I'm ready to grind
> away.
> ........
> Kid
Kid,
You need to find the best games possible. I have managed to find games that offer astronomical SCORE's. I spread 1 - 8 in a single deck game that has great pen(39+ cards dealt). My expectation is very high, 2.56% and the SCORE is 251.21. You aren't going to get this kind of SCORE backcounting as the spread required to achieve it would put you in the guaranteed ruin column.
Now these great games are very hard to find, but if this is something you want to take seriously, you have to spend some time scouting, not all of this business is glamorous, alot of it is monotonous and boring.
I can tell you this, if you aren't disciplined enough to not play unless you have a huge SCORE game with such a small bankroll, start diggin the grave now for ruin will quickly find you.
I myself started out with a fairly modest bank. The only real chance of winning that you have is doing what I said above. Find excellent games, spread as much as they will let you, and have the discipline to walk away when they take away your pen or ability to spread large.
Remember that in general N0 (or the # of hands required for SD to be cancelled by Expectation) decreases with the increase in SCORE. So in other words if you find a game like I have, it will take 40 - 50 hours to reach N0. The backcounting 6deckers in Vegas for your spread have such a low SCORE and such a high N0 that your bankroll is going to be in grave danger. but if SD doesn't get you (and the chances are very very high that it will) you can make about 20 dollars an hour backcounting, but more than likely you will run out of bank as you are going to be betting a high multiple of Kelly, and multiples of Kelly are almost always fatal.
Just my advice, red chips can get away with more than green or black as far as heat and spread, take advantage of it! play the single and dd games with High SCOREs have a good act, and pillage and plunder 'em!!!:-)
Good Deviations,
LM
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Ouchez: At the right game....
> Good for you. You are not gambling the rent
> money or the babies food money are you? Are
> you? Be honest now.
> Your young; $1K is not the end of your
> world; and truthfully there is absolutely no
> way to properly maximize a $1K BR. None.
> Is it all 6D where you go? No DD or 4D?
> I would not play all with $1K. Never. Back
> count the hell out of that place and don't
> worry so much about being thrown out. Wait
> for monster counts (> plus 5). Of course
> it's not 'optimal' but you can not optimize
> a thousand dollar BR.
> Any DD or 4D? Count and wait to play when a
> huge count comes around. Slide by, plop down
> a bet, then move on depending on the count.
> (I might limit my max bet to $50 -why, just
> to have 20 shots at the thing -again
> absolutely no quantifiable basis for that
> whatsoever.)
> Get your money in when you have a BIG
> advantage; never before.
> Don't sit down; stay fluid.
> Dont be afraid to bring it all home -you
> can't afford to settle for mediocre positive
> counts.
> And good luck -you are going to need a lot
> of it!
> 
and with the right skillz, he can do just great!
The problem is most people settle for crappy games that need such a large spread and bankroll that they forget, if they ever knew, what a real fine game can produce, with even a $1000 bankroll.
Regards,
Ouchez.
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KidDangerous: Re: One more question
> Kid,
> You need to find the best games possible. I
> have managed to find games that offer
> astronomical SCORE's. I spread 1 - 8 in a
> single deck game that has great pen(39+
> cards dealt). My expectation is very high,
> 2.56% and the SCORE is 251.21. You aren't
> going to get this kind of SCORE backcounting
> as the spread required to achieve it would
> put you in the guaranteed ruin column.
I'm the student here so this is a question not a contradiction. If I backcount and only jump in on high counts then couldn't my spread be smaller considering I'm only looking to make 20 dollars at each casino. So, I backcount, jump in play it out (this is DD I'm talking about)
at then end if I win my 20 dollars, I then get up and go to the next casino. If I don't make the 20 dollars, then I get up and go to the next casino.
My idea is to look for the absolute best game, in each casino ,count it, hit it, leave. Win or lose.
Does that sound unreasonable?
> Now these great games are very hard to find,
> but if this is something you want to take
> seriously, you have to spend some time
> scouting, not all of this business is
> glamorous, alot of it is monotonous and
> boring.
I take it very serious. I watched a show on snipers one time. They said sometimes it takes these guys a day to move 200 feet or yards (I forget which)so as to not be detected. Thats the seriousness and patience I have for this.
> I can tell you this, if you aren't
> disciplined enough to not play unless you
> have a huge SCORE game with such a small
> bankroll, start diggin the grave now for
> ruin will quickly find you.
I have driven 4 hours before, only to realize I was there at the wrong time of the wrong day. Then turn around and leave.
> I myself started out with a fairly modest
> bank. The only real chance of winning that
> you have is doing what I said above. Find
> excellent games, spread as much as they will
> let you, and have the discipline to walk
> away when they take away your pen or ability
> to spread large.
> Remember that in general N0 (or the # of
> hands required for SD to be cancelled by
> Expectation) decreases with the increase in
> SCORE. So in other words if you find a game
> like I have, it will take 40 - 50 hours to
> reach N0. The backcounting 6deckers in Vegas
> for your spread have such a low SCORE and
> such a high N0 that your bankroll is going
> to be in grave danger. but if SD doesn't get
> you (and the chances are very very high that
> it will) you can make about 20 dollars an
> hour backcounting, but more than likely you
> will run out of bank as you are going to be
> betting a high multiple of Kelly, and
> multiples of Kelly are almost always fatal.
> Just my advice, red chips can get away with
> more than green or black as far as heat and
> spread, take advantage of it! play the
> single and dd games with High SCOREs have a
> good act, and pillage and plunder 'em!!!:-)
> Good Deviations,
> LM
Thank you for your input and advice, I will do my best to pillage and plunder!!
Thanks,
Kid
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KidDangerous: Re: At the right game....
> and with the right skillz, he can do just
> great!
> The problem is most people settle for crappy
> games that need such a large spread and
> bankroll that they forget, if they ever
> knew, what a real fine game can produce,
> with even a $1000 bankroll.
> Regards,
> Ouchez.
I'm glad you chimed in Ouchez,
you and the others are always absolutely honest and helpful. It sure makes a difference in a guy's moral to be able to get this kind of input from such great minds. That is one thing I love about this game. If you lose, at least you know you lost doing the right thing. Thanks again Ouchez.
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Sun Runner: Where have you been!?
> and with the right skillz, he can do just great!
Agree.
> The problem is most people settle for crappy games
Totally agree.
He'll still need a lot of luck finding those games and not giving in to the need to play if he dosen't.
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Parker: Misc comments and grumblings
> Given the
> mentality I keep,I shall always be young
You may not grow up, but you still get old. Trust me on this one. :-P
> and the low expectations I have out of life
> (material things)
This may also change. Many years ago I was of the "I'm not into materialism" school of thought. Money may not buy happiness, but it can make misery a whole lot more comfortable.
> But my hardest day at the tables is still
> better than my easiest day at work.
Unfortunately, playing at the tables will soon become . . . work. There is an old saying that the quickest way to destroy your pleasure in anything is to do it for a living. Do you think that Tiger Woods gets up at 5:00 am on a free Saturday to go play a round at the local muncipal golf course?
BTW, whazzup with the bold type? Bold is used for placing extra emphasis on a word or phrase. If you put everything in bold, you lose that ability. The format of the page makes it obvious (with the ">" signs and hard line breaks) what is quoted text. Besides, it makes it hard to read. Please don't do it. My apologies for sounding like your 5th grade English teacher.
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KidDangerous: Re: Misc comments and grumblings
> You may not grow up, but you still get old.
> Trust me on this one. :-P
Yes I know, I just try not to think about it.
> This may also change. Many years ago I was
> of the "I'm not into materialism"
> school of thought. Money may not buy
> happiness, but it can make misery a whole
> lot more comfortable.
Yes I agree also on this. It's just at one time in my life I had anything I wanted. I didn't like it. The more things I had the more headaches I had. There are many more details and exceptions to this but, I get what you are saying and I agree.
> Unfortunately, playing at the tables will
> soon become . . . work. There is an old
> saying that the quickest way to destroy your
> pleasure in anything is to do it for a
> living. Do you think that Tiger Woods gets
> up at 5:00 am on a free Saturday to go play
> a round at the local muncipal golf course?
You know I'm not sure. It's probably not at a municipal, but if he wants to keep his A game on and keep making money he is playing somewhere.
> BTW, whazzup with the bold type? Bold is
> used for placing extra emphasis on a word or
> phrase. If you put everything in bold, you
> lose that ability. The format of the page
> makes it obvious (with the ">"
> signs and hard line breaks) what is quoted
> text. Besides, it makes it hard to read.
> Please don't do it. My apologies for
> sounding like your 5th grade English
> teacher.
My fault, but I had to do it. I was sitting here reading all the input, and I noticed you hadn't spoke up. Soooo, I thought to myself, "How could I get Parkers attention?". Then it hit me, I would just put everything in bold. He will most definitely say something then. J/K
I wasn't thinking right when I did it. My apologies.
Besides I liked the time I spent with my 5th grade English teacher. Best 3 years of all my schooling.
As usual you are absolutely right. Things change, as well as their way of thinking.
I learned real early in life that listening to people that have already walked the path can save you from twisting an ankle. I learned the hard way of course. But, I did learn.
Thanks again,
Kid
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