PaddyBoy: CSMs

[PaddyBoy]

if you are playing at a CSM with other players,6 deck,S17,DAS. sitting at 3rd base and say the RC goes to +6,this would mean that the TC is now +1,so should you incorporate any strategy variations such as double 9 v 2 or double A8 v 6.
Or if playing CSMs should you just play bs all the time,although this would mean hitting 16 v 10 at TC of 0.

[SOTSOG]

> if you are playing at a CSM with other
> players,6 deck,S17,DAS.

WHY? WHY? WHY? Best to buy in at a CSM table, and immediately leave with the chips without playing. Lowers the table hold.

>sitting at 3rd base

What difference does it make? The cards are dealt face up, so you are only going to see a couple of hit cards more, before playing decision needs to be made. You are playing a game with at the very most, two rounds of penetration -- and NOW you are worried about pen and trying to maximize it?

> and say the RC goes to +6,this would mean
> that the TC is now +1,so should you
> incorporate any strategy variations such as
> double 9 v 2 or double A8 v 6.

Yes, that is what you should do. Although most CSM machines hold 5 decks, so you are probably miscalculating your TC.

> Or if playing CSMs should you just play bs
> all the time,although this would mean
> hitting 16 v 10 at TC of 0.

No, you should make the appropriate plays. Although the question comes up, when do you reset your RC? Cards fed into the machine do not IMMEDIATELY reappear, so you should have the RC from the last round fed into the machine + the RC of the current round. Then the RC becomes the current round (now the last round) and the RC of the next new round. --- but why bother?

[Coug Fan]

> WHY? WHY? WHY? Best to buy in at a CSM
> table, and immediately leave with the chips
> without playing. Lowers the table hold.

I am thinking that they will probably give you grief if you buy in and then leave the table. What about if after buying in, you "notice" the CSM (maybe ask "that's not one of those machines that automatically spits out the cards is it?"). Then say something to the ploppies like "I don't play with those machines, its just too darned easy for them to hit a switch and get the card that they want to come out. You might as well be playing the slots."

IMHO, the more negative things you can say about a CSM (including negative ploppy superstitions), the better. Of course, I wouldn't accuse the casino of cheating, just say that it is possible.

[PaddyBoy]

> WHY? WHY? WHY? Best to buy in at a CSM
> table, and immediately leave with the chips
> without playing. Lowers the table hold.

> What difference does it make? The cards are
> dealt face up, so you are only going to see
> a couple of hit cards more, before playing
> decision needs to be made. You are playing a
> game with at the very most, two rounds of
> penetration -- and NOW you are worried about
> pen and trying to maximize it?

> Yes, that is what you should do. Although
> most CSM machines hold 5 decks, so you are
> probably miscalculating your TC.

> No, you should make the appropriate plays.
> Although the question comes up, when do you
> reset your RC? Cards fed into the machine do
> not IMMEDIATELY reappear, so you should have
> the RC from the last round fed into the
> machine + the RC of the current round. Then
> the RC becomes the current round (now the
> last round) and the RC of the next new
> round. --- but why bother?

I think I need to for cover,at this casino which is small there is only 1 real bj table the other 3 are CSMs.
I think it looks strange if every time I wait for a space at the real table even if the others are quiet,you dont look like regular gambler.
The casinos in my town are quiet small,I have already been barred from one after spreading 5 to 45.
I am still only learning so am not concerned about winrates,I want to develop a better act so later i wont have to resort to playing other games to look like a gambler

[PaddyBoy]

> I am thinking that they will probably give
> you grief if you buy in and then leave the
> table. What about if after buying in, you
> "notice" the CSM (maybe ask
> "that's not one of those machines that
> automatically spits out the cards is
> it?"). Then say something to the
> ploppies like "I don't play with those
> machines, its just too darned easy for them
> to hit a switch and get the card that they
> want to come out. You might as well be
> playing the slots."

> IMHO, the more negative things you can say
> about a CSM (including negative ploppy
> superstitions), the better. Of course, I
> wouldn't accuse the casino of cheating, just
> say that it is possible.

Kind of hard to just "notice" the machine after going there for the last 3 months.

[SOTSOG]

> Kind of hard to just "notice" the
> machine after going there for the last 3
> months.

Try - "I don't like those machines. After playing them a while, I think they mess up the flow-of-the-cards. You just don't get the same streaks that you get from a shoe."

Sounds like a ploppy gambler to me.

[PaddyBoy]

> Try - "I don't like those machines.
> After playing them a while, I think they
> mess up the flow-of-the-cards. You just
> don't get the same streaks that you get from
> a shoe."

> Sounds like a ploppy gambler to me.

Will try it.Anyway I was thinking that if you have been playing real bj and raising bets and then go to the CSM as cover.You would also have to raise your bets on the csm and end up losing even more.
Is there any way that they can be beaten,ie. with a huge spread?

[williwong21]

>I've been dabbling a bit with the CSM.Wonging anyway I jump in with a 3 spot one timer when the RC is 8.I looked at Shuffle master's website and it didn't give the exact details on when the cards come back into play.Do you know where I could find more imfo on these contraptions.I wonder what the basic strategy EV is for being dealt a true count of 2 hands and for argument sake the cards could come back out.Still experimenting or do you think this is totall waiste.Willi.

[SOTSOG]

I haven't done anything with CSMs but avoid them.
The literature on the shufflemaster machine, says it is possible for a card to appear on the next round.

You have to observe how the machine is being used. If the cards for the next round have already been ejected, before the previous rounds cards have been inserted, then of course they cannot reappear.

I would rather depend on ACT than playing negative EV games for cover. You might try google to search for shufflemaster and get more information on the machines.

I think it is a waste. Would you stand around and try to wong a normal shoe game with such poor penetration?

[williwong21]

Not quite as bad penetration as the CSM but I pass right by them anyhow and at plus 8 I'm going for it.I'll let you know how I make out and thanx for getting back to me.Willi.