How long can you holecard?

[Pokerplayer]

Thanks solo. I almost sat down just to get practice too. I do have access to hcing strategies for a variety of games so it seems like the logical first step.

[Stealth]

Beware of errors and misreads, the numbers you are speaking about appear to be assuming 100% read which is highly unlikely. At 90% read $20 Ante and $5 Pair Plus you have a $18 per hour game based on 40 round per hour. AND THE GAME HAS HUGE VARIANCE!!!!!!!!!!

[Three]

Be aware that in addition to devices most casinos have rules against team play. There may or may not be laws to back the casino up but if your play involves signals with a confederate you could run into problems at least with the casino and perhaps the law.

[Nyne]

Tthree do you have more details on this? I've never heard of any legal case involving team play where it was found to be illegal in any way, with the possible exception of the Michigan tribal case (I don't recall if that was a solo or team play). Casinos have all kinds of ridiculous rules but they don't carry the force of law. They may provide justification for backing you off or barring you but not for getting a prosecution. (They can and will arrest APs who have not broken any laws however, which is a different issue.)

Devices, on the other hand, are against the law in many jurisdictions.

[Three]

Tthree do you have more details on this? I've never heard of any legal case involving team play where it was found to be illegal in any way,

That is why I said may or may not. The casino wants you to believe it is illegal. For an AP a barring for suspeted team play is not a good thing. team play is frowned upon by the casino like masterbating on an airplane.

[moo321]

I am going to disagree with some of the posters on here. In Vegas, OCP can be sweaty. But, at a casino in dogfuck, Indiana? I doubt they're going to snap to it.

The variance is fairly high with OCP, but it's also a 3%+ game, and the heat is less than counting. The biggest downside that I see is the game speed. If you can figure out a way to speed up the game (even playing with other APs can help with this) the game gets a lot better.

Also, the original post is getting very close to the line of "too much information" for a public forum. I don't like talking about what specific vulnerabilities look like.

[Pokerplayer]

Information removed Moo. How crazy does the variance get for 3cp?

[blackjackomaha]

Information removed Moo. How crazy does the variance get for 3cp?

Very crazy. Need proper BR, correct reads (100% with this game), correct strategy, etc to handle swings. It wouldn't be out of the question to be down 200-250 units.

[moo321]

What BJ Omaha said.

At a bare minimum, you have to pick off aces from non-aces. A paint/no paint game is a waste of time.

I believe "The book" has ROR information for this game.

[Pierce]

The variance is so high that Grosjean states you are more likely to be ahead after 5 hands than 50.

[moo321]

Basically, you're sitting there playing at a disadvantage, slowly grinding away waiting until you hit a straight flush or trips to get a 4 or 5-1 payoff. I've played a whole shift and not hit a straight flush or trips.

[wookets]

Basically, you're sitting there playing at a disadvantage, slowly grinding away waiting until you hit a straight flush or trips to get a 4 or 5-1 payoff. I've played a whole shift and not hit a straight flush or trips.

3.48% is 3.48%.

[AP360]

Agreed, the advantage is clearly present -- noone will dispute that. The stomach for the variance and proper BR are another issue altogether. These are all important factors that need to be taken into consideration. One way to look at it is, it's like counting cards at a constant max bet. You know you have the advantage every round, but you must be well BR'red and prepared to lose ALL your splits and doubles while dealer makes miraculous back-to-back 5-6 cards 21's.