Andrew: Whats the definition of going pro?

[Andrew]

first of all excuse my bad english.

Ive bin reading some postings about going pro. I would really like to know what the definition of beieng a pro is.

In the earlyer posting: "going pro someday?" they are talking of bankrols of 30k, being far to less to become a pro.

If a poker player for instants, wins an avarge of 100$ a day, playing tournaments. If this money would be more then enougf to live off. wouldend this player be a pro poker player?

I'm a newbee, with only a bankroll of 5k. This 100$ a day would be my goal. Is there any chance of making this?

I would love to get some feedback

[Dave Jay]

> Ive bin reading some postings about going
> pro. I would really like to know what the
> definition of beieng a pro is.

Most define it as one who depends on the game for their livelihood and done competently.

> I'm a newbee, with only a bankroll of 5k.
> This 100$ a day would be my goal. Is there
> any chance of making this?

You can strive to average $100 per day while understanding and accepting a quantifiable risk. You need to determine your game rules, betting strategy, hands per hour, hours played, to get more specific.

[Brick]

I dont know how anyody could answer your questions correctly. What i can say , is if you average $100 bucks a day for years and making a living at it, then you are indeed a PRO. However you are asking can you do it with a $5,000 bank playing poker?

You only know where you stand,nobody else does. If you were a PRO pool player and a newbie ask you the same question,how in the hell do you answer it?

Brick

Ive bin reading some postings about going
> pro. I would really like to know what the
> definition of beieng a pro is.

> In the earlyer posting: "going pro
> someday?" they are talking of bankrols
> of 30k, being far to less to become a pro.

> If a poker player for instants, wins an
> avarge of 100$ a day, playing tournaments.
> If this money would be more then enougf to
> live off. wouldend this player be a pro
> poker player?

> I'm a newbee, with only a bankroll of 5k.
> This 100$ a day would be my goal. Is there
> any chance of making this?

> I would love to get some feedback

[Andrew]

> I dont know how anyody could answer your
> questions correctly. What i can say , is if
> you average $100 bucks a day for years and
> making a living at it, then you are indeed a
> PRO. However you are asking can you do it
> with a $5,000 bank playing poker?

> You only know where you stand,nobody else
> does. If you were a PRO pool player and a
> newbie ask you the same question,how in the
> hell do you answer it?

> Brick

You are o so right.

The thing is, in some postings I read about bankrols of 30K being 90K short for becoming a pro. Then 5k would just be enougf to eat a nice icecream.

For the time being i'm sticking to playing black jack. Playing poker is one of my hobby's, But I would love to play it for means of making a living. From next week I will be staying in LV for the periode of a year. I'm giving myself that time to learn how to play poker (like a pro). but on the and of that year I will not have a bankrol of 120K, or even 30K. So if thats what it takes, next to playing a good game ofcours, whats the use of trying.

so my goals:
Improving my game the coming year.
Playing tournament poker (preffer online)
Scoring an avarege of 100$ a day
Starting with a bankroll of 5K

[DD']

It means you've given up your normal 9 to 5 job and will now rely on bj as your primary income source. 30K is not generally enough for bj, not really even close. But four people who combined their 30K might be about right. Poker is far different. The variance isn't as big and you don't need to constantly travel the entire country or world. A pro bj player spends half his life on the road and routinely shows a net loss for periods of six months or longer. If going six months to a year without any income would put you in a serious bind and cause you to start using your bankroll for living expenses then you are certainly not ready to be a solo pro. I would say that minimally you should have a bankroll equal to your desired annual income and a seperate reserve of 6 to 12 months living expenses. Being nearly debt free goes without saying.

[PunkEye]

First off, get hold of Wong's book Blackjack Secrets. It provides a fairly accurate discourse on what is involved playing blackjack professionally. But I will tell you up front it's a really, really tough undertaking. Far better would be to limit your activity to tournament play exclusively. The whipsaws are likely to be absent and you stand a very good chance of making it a decent to excellent livelihood. Glad to see you have expressed an interest in poker as well. Good luck and never stop studying.

[pat]

t means you've given up your normal 9 to 5
> job and will now rely on bj as your primary
> income source. 30K is not generally enough
> for bj, not really even close. But four
> people who combined their 30K might be about
> right. Poker is far different. The variance
> isn't as big and you don't need to
> constantly travel the entire country or
> world. A pro bj player spends half his life
> on the road and routinely shows a net loss
> for periods of six months or longer. If
> going six months to a year without any
> income would put you in a serious bind and
> cause you to start using your bankroll for
> living expenses then you are certainly not
> ready to be a solo pro. I would say that
> minimally you should have a bankroll equal
> to your desired annual income and a seperate
> reserve of 6 to 12 months living expenses.

I went pro with half that amount.all this talk about needing some huge bankroll is bogus.if you play shoes,maybe,but if you stick to double deck you dont need as much as the "experts" tell you.i have never lost more than 130 NET units playing bj.most of my losing streaks are about 100 units and are then followed by huge wins.my longest losing streak was 2 months.as far as poker goes-screw it.poker blows.its BORINGGGGG and the people you have to surround yourself with are complete jerks.stick to bj and make a nice living.

[Parker]

Sure, people frequently "go pro" with far less than the amounts that DD' recommended.

People also go broke all the time as well. The fact that you've succeeded (so far) proves only that you were fortunate enough to avoid an early sustained negative swing.

Or, to put it another way: You've been lucky.

DD' has probably forgotten more about playing blackjack professionally than most of us will ever know. I recommend in the strongest terms that anyone considering going pro take his advice to heart.

[DD']

If your biggest losing streak has been 100 units and not lasted longer than 2 months then you are either very lucky or have a very small sample size.

BJ has been my only income source for more than six years. I also started with far less, and failed a few times until I was lucky. Yes, you can take a shot with far less money. I'm talking about being a legitimate professional. I'm also talking about living a middle class lifestyle. If you have a bank less than 30K and don't have lots of money put away for expenses than I would not bet on you still being in business 24 months from now.

If you are a single person with no obligations then go ahead and take a shot if you don't mind risking everything to pursue a dream. But such people should understand that the odds are against them and that they'll need some luck to get over the hump. I know lots of pro gamblers and I honestly can't think of one who I believe is playing to a bank less than 100K.

[pat]

> If your biggest losing streak has been 100
> units and not lasted longer than 2 months
> then you are either very lucky or have a
> very small sample size.

> BJ has been my only income source for more
> than six years. I also started with far
> less, and failed a few times until I was
> lucky. Yes, you can take a shot with far
> less money. I'm talking about being a
> legitimate professional. I'm also talking
> about living a middle class lifestyle. If
> you have a bank less than 30K and don't have
> lots of money put away for expenses than I
> would not bet on you still being in business
> 24 months from now.

> If you are a single person with no
> obligations then go ahead and take a shot if
> you don't mind risking everything to pursue
> a dream. But such people should understand
> that the odds are against them and that
> they'll need some luck to get over the hump.
> I know lots of pro gamblers and I honestly
> can't think of one who I believe is playing
> to a bank less than 100K.
granted,i dont have kids or a wife(thank god).my car is paid for so my bills are not much.my advice is for single people.15k is not enough if your bills are 4 g a month.although,100k bank is crazy.you dont need that much unless your betting yellow.if i listened to all the authors who said i should use 5% ror,i would still be betting 10 to 40.dd,my biggest net loss has been 130 units but my average loss is usually 100 units.i just think the bankroll needed for bj is far less than people say.to answer your question to how long:about 18 months.thats the long run imho.sure there is some outside chance that i will lose 200 units but i could also get hit by a bus.i think most people will do fine looking at the +.

[Norm Wattenberger]

In the arena of professional BJ, DD's words are platinum. If I found myself disagreeing with him, I'd be worried.

norm

BJStats

[DD']

If you bet anything close to that big you will be broke with nearly 100% certainty. The ROR equation is based on all funds going back into the bank forever. If you take 75% of your ev and apply it to living expenses then it doesn't leave much to cover the inevitable downturns.

You are just getting your feet wet. I hope you have no major negative fluxes before you establish yourself a legitimate bankroll. But if you fail to get the point then it is likely you will continue to live life on the edge.

[pat]

> In the arena of professional BJ, DD's words
> are platinum. If I found myself disagreeing
> with him, I'd be worried.

> norm
from software,so i dont think your opinion about dd being right holds much weight with me.thats not a diss-just a fact.imho,agreeing with dd that you need a 100k bank to play pro bj is really irresponsible.