MGP CA: DD S17 DAS LS - 16 vs 9

[Freightman]

This will end now.

I trust so. Both have come at me hard without provocation. And just to clarify, didn’t call them names, simply used their name’s in an analogy. Another analogy - soft core VS hard core which categorizes the difference.

There is nothing creative about a post calling two members, not even in the thread, names for no useful reason whatsoever.

Regardless of above, it was creative. If my recollection is correct, a possible other solution would be to redact everything except the last line which would add additional appreciative substance to the comments of post 35.

[2Bornot2B]

Depends on where in the deck

0.5% is the value of a ten per deck

So what?
No comment.


Which is why 10 as a first card gives you such an edge
Irrelevant to my question.



Again, so what?

No comment.

Where are you getting these numbers? Further, to figure out where you’re going, the question is why do you need to know

In summary, the 10 as a second card does not depreciate the value of 10 as a first card. In fact, the 10 as a second card is why the 10 as a first card has so much value.

The "numbers" are from Griffin..and I am not talking about a ten as a second card, I am talking about a ten as a "hit card", which could be second, third, fourth or whatever. I am wanting to know the advantage/disadvantage value of a ten as hit card for both the dealer and the player.
Thanks for your input to a serious question.

[Freightman]

The "numbers" are from Griffin..and I am not talking about a ten as a second card, I am talking about a ten as a "hit card", which could be second, third, fourth or whatever. I am wanting to know the advantage/disadvantage value of a ten as hit card for both the dealer and the player.
Thanks for your input to a serious question.

in other words, Player 2,3,4,5,6 card 10 v Dealer 10?
The real math guys need to way in here, but something tells me the value changes based on the number of cards comprising player 10

[2Bornot2B]

Yes...hit card ten...for player and for dealer...irrespective of the composition of the 2-card initial hand.

[k_c]

Yes, I understand aabout removal effects of cards. What I need to know is, for example:
The value of an extra ten per deck from the card counting perspective is 0.5%...
That value comprises the value of the hit effect of the ten PLUS the value of the ten as a first card...
Now the value of an extra ten from the perspective of first card effect is +13% when the ten lands on the player's spot and 17% when it lands on the dealer's spot, i.e., a net value of -4%..
Therefore the hit card component of the 0.5% advantage is actually greater than 0.5%...
But I need to know how to calculate how much greater it is.
Hope I have explained my puzzle!!!

The value of a 10 is dependent upon the shoe composition. Suppose the shoe consists of all tens. In that case the value is 0 because all hands result in a push whether one ten is removed or not.

This is a special condition. You could create any number of special conditions where the value of a 10 would be different for each, including specific player hands versus specific dealer hands and differing shoe compositions.

k_c

[Freightman]

Yes...hit card ten...for player and for dealer...irrespective of the composition of the 2-card initial hand.

reread my post- I edited and added - more than once

[2Bornot2B]

in other words, Player 2,3,4,5,6 card 10 v Dealer 10?
The real math guys need to way in here, but something tells me the value changes based on the number of cards comprising player 10

I hope I have explained myself well enough to spark interest..again, what I need to know is the value of the ten (eventually all card denominations) as a hit card...precisely what Griffin did for initial cards of a hand, I want to do for the hit cards of the hand.

[2Bornot2B]

I mean a normal full deck composition.

[2Bornot2B]

The value of a 10 is dependent upon the shoe composition. Suppose the shoe consists of all tens. In that case the value is 0 because all hands result in a push whether one ten is removed or not.

This is a special condition. You could create any number of special conditions where the value of a 10 would be different for each, including specific player hands versus specific dealer hands and differing shoe compositions.

k_c

Please read my posts to Freightman for further clarifications...

[Freightman]

I hope I have explained myself well enough to spark interest..again, what I need to know is the value of the ten (eventually all card denominations) as a hit card...precisely what Griffin did for initial cards of a hand, I want to do for the hit cards of the hand.

After I finally understood your question which was diabolically deceptive , I again ask my self why is this important. And so, on the occasion of your Bar Mitzvah (different post), and so, I’ll answer your question with yet another analogy (first for you) for the day.

Some years back (24 I think) I was out shopping for a new car. The sales guy insisted on lifting the hood, showed me something or other, asked my opinion to which I honestly answered - I really don’t give a shit.

It was enough for me to know that the car was well engineered and had favourable ratings in Consumer Reports. I’m essentially a very lazy person letting others do the research, having still others confirm the findings allowing me the pleasure of smoking a good cigar on my deck while absorbing the voluminous reams of information.. Hell, I still haven’t actually simmed the effective and regaled FBM ASC. So, thank you Don, Stanford, Snyder etc. for your effective contributions to my personal relief fund.

To put this into final perspective (maybe there’s something I’m just not seeing), the additional minuscule edge potentially generated by your (diabolically deceptive) question probably won’t make a hill of beans difference in your lifetime.

[Norm]

Curiosity is important. Knowledge is important. Don't let anyone dissuade you from study.

[2Bornot2B]

After I finally understood your question which was diabolically deceptive , I again ask my self why is this important. And so, on the occasion of your Bar Mitzvah (different post), and so, I’ll answer your question with yet another analogy (first for you) for the day.

Some years back (24 I think) I was out shopping for a new car. The sales guy insisted on lifting the hood, showed me something or other, asked my opinion to which I honestly answered - I really don’t give a shit.

It was enough for me to know that the car was well engineered and had favourable ratings in Consumer Reports. I’m essentially a very lazy person letting others do the research, having still others confirm the findings allowing me the pleasure of smoking a good cigar on my deck while absorbing the voluminous reams of information.. Hell, I still haven’t actually simmed the effective and regaled FBM ASC. So, thank you Don, Stanford, Snyder etc. for your effective contributions to my personal relief fund.

To put this into final perspective (maybe there’s something I’m just not seeing), the additional minuscule edge potentially generated by your (diabolically deceptive) question probably won’t make a hill of beans difference in your lifetime.

I appreciate your sense of humour. I am a failed research chemical engineer and the things that stay in my memory are the many times that pure curiousity resulted in surprising outcomes...not always "hill of beans"...I thank you for your engagement in my curious puzzle..hasta otra vez, amigo...

[Freightman]

Curiosity is important. Knowledge is important. Don't let anyone dissuade you from study.

Point well taken. Comments made were a generality VS an absolute. Similarly, I18 captures most of index value available - good enough for most as a generality - though it is an absolute that additional value is available simply by study and execution. Is that an analogy?