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Thread: Illustrious 18 - indexes

  1. #14


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    Quote Originally Posted by aceside View Post
    Can anybody explain the discrepancy?
    Yes, of course. Card-counting.com is wrong. Did that ever occur to you?

    Don

  2. #15
    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    No, it's correct. He's misreading it.
    "I don't think outside the box; I think of what I can do with the box." - Henri Matisse

  3. #16


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    Quote Originally Posted by aceside View Post
    These are pretty close anyway, but last week when I looked up these chart views on card-counting.com, it shows the insurance index is 2.4 for 6-deck s-17, das, las. It is clearly printed on the picture figure there. However, I later discovered that it should be +3. Can anybody explain the discrepancy?
    Quote Originally Posted by Norm View Post
    No, it's correct. He's misreading it.
    Apologies. Didn't realize this was your site! Rarely referred to it by that name. Anyway, sure. Your indices are in the middle of the boxes and not on the line vertices.

    Don

  4. #17
    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DSchles View Post
    Your indices are in the middle of the boxes and not on the line vertices.
    Works better for most charts. But, I'm going to change it in CVData for index charts. To do this now,

    Click on Designer
    Click XAxis
    Turn on Labels on Ticks
    "I don't think outside the box; I think of what I can do with the box." - Henri Matisse

  5. #18
    Senior Member Tarzan's Avatar
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    In calculating precise indices, you'll find that for quite a few hands, 8vs4, 9vs7, 9vs8, 10vsT, 10vsA, 15vs8, 15vs9, 15vsT, and the list goes on, that the index moves dependent upon number of decks remaining. The index for the play is different at one deck remaining than what it is with 4 decks remaining. Some hands remain absolutely in sync with the index constant regardless of numbers of decks remaining, though. I've noticed slight variations in people's calculations dependent upon method used, however quite close to one another, over here it's +1 but over there it's +2 sort of thing, but I thought I'd bring up that fascinating fact, the index moving up or down dependent upon number of decks remaining with certain hands, whereas on others it doesn't.

  6. #19
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    This is reasonable. The portion of pairs will drop a lot as the number of decks drops, while the portions of all other hands will slightly increase. All these indices involving pairs will change a lot with the number of decks.

  7. #20
    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    No aceside, that's completely false. That makes sense as to the number of original decks -- not remaining decks. Tarzan is correct in that indices can change as penetration changes. That's because TC frequencies change.
    "I don't think outside the box; I think of what I can do with the box." - Henri Matisse

  8. #21
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    I am not so sure but I guess the root problem is the disproportion of the pair to the non-pair. TC frequency is not the main problem.

  9. #22
    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    You are posting nonsense again. A shoe is a shoe, from start to end. Knowledge of the shoe changes as you see more cards. The shoe itself does not change. TC frequencies change as knowledge increases. Suppose you cut in a different spot. Would you expect pair frequencies to change?
    "I don't think outside the box; I think of what I can do with the box." - Henri Matisse

  10. #23
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    To prove I am right, let me show you an example. For a 8-deck shoe, when I have a hand of (7,7)vs8, I split the (7,7) pair when TC>+2 during the first two decks, but split the (7,7) pair when TC>-1 during the last two decks. This is the same shoe, but I play the remaining two decks as if they are a 2-deck new shoe. Have I been using the correct strategy?
    Last edited by aceside; 04-13-2021 at 10:09 PM.

  11. #24
    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    Why do you do that? Right or wrong, it's not relevant. If the shoe was dealt backwards, would you reverse what you are doing?
    "I don't think outside the box; I think of what I can do with the box." - Henri Matisse

  12. #25
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    Let me think about this for a day. Thank you.

  13. #26


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    Quote Originally Posted by aceside View Post
    Let me think about this for a day. Thank you.
    Sigh. Is there any possibility, remote as it may be, that, going forward, you might possibly think before you put your foot squarely in your mouth? Is there any possibility that you'll show any kind of humility whatsoever, when discussing blackjack with some of the foremost authorities in the world, and entertain some restraint in trying to teach us one more ridiculously absurd theory after another?

    Don

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