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Thread: About insurance...

  1. #27


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    2 Points about Insurance

    Quote Originally Posted by Freightman View Post
    Yes, case 2. Most places won’t allow you to insure player blackjack against dealer ace.
    Basic blackjack rules state that when the dealer has an Ace up, the player can take Insurance for half his bet, OR LESS. It doesn’t matter what the player’s hand is since Insurance is a separate side bet. Hence, someone who has blackjack against an Ace could decline even money and take Insurance for LESS, perhaps much less if he can’t stomach the risk of coming away empty handed. It’s not the Max EV move, but yields more than routinely taking full even money and may look better than rejecting it altogether.

    Also, since the casino makes a net profit on all its Insurance bets combined, it would likely make a net increased profit from allowing players to take even money and take full Insurance on their blackjacks as well. A $50 ploppy would net either $25 or $100 by doing so. His rationale being that he either reduces his profit by $25 or increases it by $50.

  2. #28


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    Quote Originally Posted by Renzey View Post
    Basic blackjack rules state that when the dealer has an Ace up, the player can take Insurance for half his bet, OR LESS. It doesn’t matter what the player’s hand is since Insurance is a separate side bet. Hence, someone who has blackjack against an Ace could decline even money and take Insurance for LESS, perhaps much less if he can’t stomach the risk of coming away empty handed. It’s not the Max EV move, but yields more than routinely taking full even money and may look better than rejecting it altogether.

    Also, since the casino makes a net profit on all its Insurance bets combined, it would likely make a net increased profit from allowing players to take even money and take full Insurance on their blackjacks as well. A $50 ploppy would net either $25 or $100 by doing so. His rationale being that he either reduces his profit by $25 or increases it by $50.
    Notwithstanding what is or is not allowed in any particular store or jurisdiction, the “educated” ploppy will not take insurance. He has been “taught” that insurance (about the highest edge that a casino has) is a sucker bet. Now, if we want to get technical and look at individual true count bins, we can determine that buying insurance becomes profitable, for the counter, at and beyond certain true count thresholds. If we want to get even more technical, we can adjust these thresholds, or strike points, through determination of surplus/deficit of aces as well as surplus/deficit of intermediate cards.

    Now, the store makes money on insurance on everybody, except the competent counter who knows when and when not to, take insurance. We agree that insurance is nothing more than a side bet.

    Last, heat not withstanding, for the store that allows even money on dealer ace up card, and further allows insurance, the $10 blackjack has the potential of earning $20, but from a more practical perspective, will likely earn $16 or $17 taking into account those insurance bets that he will lose.

  3. #29


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    Thankfully, the way we play, we take all guesswork out of the insurance bet.

  4. #30


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    I’m Just Sayin’

    [/QUOTE] The educated ploppy will not take insurance because he has been taught that it is a sucker bet.
    [QUOTE=Freightman;293569]

    Yes, the well read basic strategy player knows to decline Insurance or even money, and if quizzed on it will answer correctly. But when it comes down to crunch time at the table with blackjack against an Ace, the vast majority will cave and take the Chicken Money. I’m just pointing out that for them,taking Insurance on say, a $50 blackjack for $10 will skirt around the possibility of getting paid nothing by netting either $20 or $65, and will average $51 which is more than even money. Still, declining altogether will average $52.
    Last edited by Renzey; 11-22-2020 at 10:43 PM.

  5. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by DSchles View Post
    FWIW, in 45 years, I have NEVER heard of this. Must be a very special brand of stupid! All managers start out stupid, but clearly, there are varying degrees. This is the nth degree!

    Don
    X2...never saw this in my nearly 40 years world-wide, either

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