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Thread: The best level one system $1000 contest

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    2 out of 6 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No

    The best level one system $1000 contest

    Let's settle the "what's the best Blackjack counting system" debate once and for all with a contest. I'll pay $1000 in bitcoin to the submission with the highest SCORE in CVCX, subject to the following rules:
    Stations DD rules (2D H17 DAS 75%pen RS4 noRSA noSurrender 1burncard)
    Single-parameter Level1 count
    6 to 1 spread
    one hand only
    Play All
    <= 50 indices (counting insurance, not counting A9vX indices if they're a copy of TTvX)
    No depth-based or composition-based indices.
    No suit-aware tags.
    If you do true count conversion, Quarter Deck is the limit on deck estimation. No Exact Card.

    If there is a tie, whoever posted it first gets the prize.
    Winning submissions will be independently verified in CVCX so don't go messing around with wonging/bonuses.

    To be eligible for the prize, you have to beat my system by 1%: https://imgur.com/a/0pTNEFs
    That means you need a score of 80.76 in a CVCX sim of at least 10 billion rounds.
    Submit your entry by replying to this thread with a screenshot of the sim and all the index tables (just like my imgur link above). Upload it somewhere instead of posting as an attachment because BJTF will make the resolution too low to read.

    The contest ends Nov 30 at midnight.
    Last edited by scroogemcduck; 10-12-2020 at 08:23 PM. Reason: 10 billion rounds min; no suit-aware

  2. #2


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    For some context, on these rules, CVCX's built in sim for Wong's complete hi-lo system (213 indices) does 4.5% worse than my 50-index KO. Halves Full using all the indices between -5 and +10 (way over 50) does a fraction of a percent worse than my 50-index KO (and as a level 3 count, halves wouldn't qualify). I don't expect to have to pay out, but if I do, it'll be worth $1000 to get an extra 1% EV over a lifetime.

  3. #3


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    Quote Originally Posted by scroogemcduck View Post
    For some context, on these rules, CVCX's built in sim for Wong's complete hi-lo system (213 indices) does 4.5% worse than my 50-index KO. Halves Full using all the indices between -5 and +10 (way over 50) does a fraction of a percent worse than my 50-index KO (and as a level 3 count, halves wouldn't qualify). I don't expect to have to pay out, but if I do, it'll be worth $1000 to get an extra 1% EV over a lifetime.
    I surmise your collaboration with bjanalyst? It may well be true what you claim regarding halves, maybe. However, Halves FBM ASC Basic would then handily defeat you. Halves FBM ASC Advanced would therefore - Crush you

  4. #4
    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Of course, you would need an exact definition of level 1. Some people believe Red7 is level 1 and some don't. By single-parameter, I assume you mean no side counts of any kind.
    "Croyez ceux qui cherchent la vérité, doutez de ceux qui la trouvent." --André Gide

  5. #5


    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Scroogemgduck and BZjAnalyst, they be identical twins?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Norm View Post
    Of course, you would need an exact definition of level 1. Some people believe Red7 is level 1 and some don't.
    I'll define level one as all the tags are -1, 0, or 1. So Red7 is eligible.

    By single-parameter, I assume you mean no side counts of any kind.
    Correct.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeBabar View Post
    Scroogemgduck and BZjAnalyst, they be identical twins?
    I don't know BJAnalyst and I developed this myself using CVData RA BTD with some manual tweaks to the Hard DD indices to move them down from RA to almost MaxEV levels to conserve cards in positive counts.

  7. #7
    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Ahh, Red7 is level I. That means this is also.

    Double deck:

    Club Diamond Heart Spade
    Ace -1 -1 0 0
    2 1 1 1 0
    3 1 1 1 0
    4 1 1 1 1
    5 1 1 1 1
    6 1 1 1 1
    7 1 1 0 0
    8 0 0 0 0
    9 -1 -1 0 0
    Ten -1 -1 -1 -1

    Six Deck:

    Club Diamond Heart Spade
    Ace -1 -1 -1 -1
    2 1 1 1 0
    3 1 1 1 1
    4 1 1 1 1
    5 1 1 1 1
    6 1 1 1 1
    7 1 1 0 0
    8 0 0 0 0
    9 -1 0 0 0
    Ten -1 -1 -1 -1

    Actually, this could be further refined into something that no human could handle -- but still be level I under that definition.
    "Croyez ceux qui cherchent la vérité, doutez de ceux qui la trouvent." --André Gide

  8. #8


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    Quote Originally Posted by Norm View Post
    Ahh, Red7 is level I. That means this is also.
    ...
    Actually, this could be further refined into something that no human could handle -- but still be level I under that definition.
    Yes, but they'd have no chance of winning anyway, because suit-aware counts use irrelevant info that just adds noise to the RC. Red7 is much worse than either KO or Hi-Lo.

    Since CVCX doesn't support simming strategies with different values for red and black, suit aware counts are implicitly banned.

  9. #9


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    The screenshot should be based on a minimum of 10 billion rounds in CVCX.

  10. #10
    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    True, you need CVData for simming strategies with different values for red and black. Although, there is less noise than one might suspect. In shoe games, Red7 is a decent strategy.

    In any case, the tags I posted are ridiculous, even though they would work. Just posted these for fun.
    Last edited by Norm; 10-12-2020 at 11:00 AM.
    "Croyez ceux qui cherchent la vérité, doutez de ceux qui la trouvent." --André Gide

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