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Thread: First Week Back on the Road

  1. #1


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    First Week Back on the Road

    After a 20 year break from the game I had my first week back playing 4-5 days a week. The first few days where mostly recon to see what games where available/playable. I was shocked to see that actually nothing had changed and the games where excellent. I could play just about everywhere with the exception of a few places in which I could not wong out as not enough open tables (and players) on shoe games. I have yet to find a place that breaks the shoe when all players leave. Because of this I have pretty much ruled out these places as I cannot move around during the low volume weekdays.

    The first day I came upon a young counter who played with no fear. I felt a bit weird taking insurance and betting up at the same time so I decided to let this guy hammer them by himself. Absolutely no heat on a hand held game at 20 to 1. This and another nearby place are gold mines so these where on my list to play once a week and will be my primary "go to" games. Pen varies from 80 to 60 depending on the dealer but its all beatable with shuffle card.

    The next few days I played shoes using a wong out strategy only. I use KO so I started using the early true/rc count mods as described in the "Color of Blackjack" kindle book. KO is pretty weak early in the shoe and these mods made a huge impact. I was definitely getting more action in with 1-3 decks in the tray. For me this was a game changer and I find myself migrating to the shoes with better rules. One place had surrender and I think I was only player who ever used it. Every time I surrendered a player would ask what that was all about. Most players do not even know the rule exists and the casino does not advertise it either. I had to ask at every joint.

    I then traveled a bit further south to recon some of the other games later in the week. One place only had 1 shoe game open but I decided to play it as it was low minimum. After a few decks it was apparent the other player here was also a counter playing a 40 to 1 spread with the pit barely even caring. After a few hours he left (on the way out he whispered in my ear that I didn't make one mistake which caught me off guard) and another guy sat down. He had a fanny pack so my first instinct was he was also a counter. The shoe went hot and out came the black at 80 to 1 spread. Yep..the fanny pack is always a dead giveaway. The pit could care less. I could not believe how bad the management was here. In Vegas I would have been escorted to the door by now. I could tell this guy was a "true count zombie" trying to do division in his head. He also needed to chew some gum as his lips where moving when he counted. I was also wondering if he had the roll to play to nearly max bet as his girlfriend really sweated the action. I felt like he was trying to make rent. He was definitely using a true count system as he doubled on A8 vs 6. This is only a play I use on single deck but in this particular situation I am sure it was correct and liked it. For shoes I only use a few indices to make things easy. With the bad management it was obvious why there was a slug of counters pounding it.

    I then traveled further south to a big busy place with a ton of two deck. Pen was marginable but beatable. They had a shuffle card but they didn't seem to use it. When they felt it was close they just shuffled. I got caught off guard the first time. The next time I dragged my chips out of the square and made sure I was going to see another round before throwing it out there. One thing I hate doing is throwing out a big bet and having to pull it back. It just looks bad.

    After this week it was obvious to me that the game is just as good as it was in the 1990s. I am elated I can play again.

  2. #2


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    I am incredulous you see no changes in game quality after 20 years. Are you playing in the US? If so, can you give me a hint as to your region?

  3. #3


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    Quote Originally Posted by snakeplisskin View Post
    I am incredulous you see no changes in game quality after 20 years. Are you playing in the US? If so, can you give me a hint as to your region?
    Yeah I am a bit incredulous as well. I live up in the Pacific Northwest. Games everywhere. I have access to 7 casinos all within an hours drive time. Having seen how good these games are I believe I will have to checkout the top two gold mines of the 1990s. One is an out of the way place in the midwest and another I can fly into via local junket flights. The latter was so good we called it "The Motherlode". Definitely the greatest game on the planet..or at least it was. Now I have to find out. I am 20 years older. No way they could recognize me right?

  4. #4


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    Quote Originally Posted by Shalako View Post
    Yeah I am a bit incredulous as well. I live up in the Pacific Northwest. Games everywhere. I have access to 7 casinos all within an hours drive time. Having seen how good these games are I believe I will have to checkout the top two gold mines of the 1990s. One is an out of the way place in the midwest and another I can fly into via local junket flights. The latter was so good we called it "The Motherlode". Definitely the greatest game on the planet..or at least it was. Now I have to find out. I am 20 years older. No way they could recognize me right?
    I'm interested in where that out of the way place in the midwest is located. If it is where I think it might be, it is no longer a honey pot.

    I'm guessing the "Motherlode" is Wendover as that is the only decent place I know of that has junkets. By the way, Wendover is not the same as it was a few years ago in several different respects..

  5. #5


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    Quote Originally Posted by Midwest Player View Post
    I'm interested in where that out of the way place in the midwest is located. If it is where I think it might be, it is no longer a honey pot.

    I'm guessing the "Motherlode" is Wendover as that is the only decent place I know of that has junkets. By the way, Wendover is not the same as it was a few years ago in several different respects..
    Yep that was the Motherlode all right. Back in the day it was unbelievable. What has changed? Yeah the other honey pot was that 4 deck game up north right?

  6. #6


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    What is the significance of a fanny pack? Why would this define a counter?

  7. #7
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    In The Blackjack Insiders, author Andrew Uyal talked about how he loved the deep pen on shoe games in Seattle. In addition, one casino was even quite appreciative of his business since they rarely get players betting at his level.

  8. #8


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    I swear that 80% of the counters I ran into had fanny packs with all their dough and chips in it. It got to the point that they might as well just have stamped a big "C" on their forehead. I almost started laughing the other day when this guy sat down. I knew instantly.

  9. #9


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    Quote Originally Posted by LugiaLvl138 View Post
    In The Blackjack Insiders, author Andrew Uyal talked about how he loved the deep pen on shoe games in Seattle. In addition, one casino was even quite appreciative of his business since they rarely get players betting at his level.
    It is decent pen on the shoes but nothing spectacular. I have not seen much high action in general but I did come across a player betting two hands of house max one day. I guess he was a regular. He was a basic player but also played a bunch of those -EV side bets (Royal Match etc) which probably tripled the house edge on him. Another regular at the table told me he would usually keep playing until he cleaned out the rack. He must think he can win more hands then the dealer? Good luck on that...

  10. #10


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    Early KO #'s make shoe abandon better I bet. But if there's a high volume place that does not care... well you *could* wear a giant "C" on your sweater - that is, pure wong in and abandon. No negative hands all day (well, practically). Feels great. Good exercise. If your bet is bigger than everyone else's, their complaints have no merit. Heh maybe not the best for preserving local joint.

  11. #11


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    The problem I am having is no shoes to abandon too during the week. Most of the places only have one BJ table open with one exception. The one exception has rather high minimums (at least for my current roll) so that game is marginal at best. It is still +EV so I will have to roll with it for now as I do not want to pound the two deck games too heavily. I have not played enough to know how much they can take but so far it seems like eternity.

  12. #12


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    Quote Originally Posted by Shalako View Post
    Yep that was the Motherlode all right. Back in the day it was unbelievable. What has changed? Yeah the other honey pot was that 4 deck game up north right?
    Not sure what you mean by up north in the midwest. Are you talking about the U.P. of MI. At one time there were some 4 deck games in the U.P. I just went back to a 2001 issue of CBJN and found a 4 deck, S17 game, with $2 to $200 betting limits, das, and rsa. House edge listed as .29%. That game is now a 6 deck h17 game. Also I always thought Kewadin offered pretty good games, but they were 6 deck. However, they had dsa, and ls. House edge was .25%. They also went to hell.

    The oldest CBJN copy I have is from March 1999. In it I found a single deck h17, ds, ls game at LCO casino. The house edge was listed at .02%. If it was true it sure didn't last very long.

  13. #13


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    Shalako, I received your email. Thank you. I have played at your midwest honey pot casino, but not lately. I was flat betted there way back in 2003. From looking at CBJN it appears the games haven't changed much there.

    The other casino you mentioned I also got the boot from way back in 2006. I also stayed at the Candlelite Motel several times. Real cheap rates and the guy said if I didn't use the other bed he would give me another $5 or $10 discount. Can't remember what it was, but it was a very inexpensive stay.

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