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Thread: insurance decks table

  1. #1


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    insurance decks table

    Can someone explain how to populate this or how to understand it? What is it for in the Insurance/Counts tab and is it somehow tied to when insurance is worth taking? I cannot piece it together from the documentation.

  2. #2


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    from what I can infer, the values in the decks are simply what the true count needs to be in order to make insurance viable? i.e. if there are 2 decks in the shoe, you look under the decks table and if the value is 3, then the card count needs to be 3+ to take insurance. Is that right? If so, why would the values be dependent on the number of decks remaining? I would have thought the true count normalizes that as it does for the hand playing.

  3. #3


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    How are people learning card counting these days? It all seems backwards based on the questions being asked.

    OP: did you buy the software as your starting point for learning card counting?

    To All: remember everyone thinking boot camps are over priced and you just need a book?

  4. #4


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    I casually googled and researched a little about hi-lo and hi-opt and tried my hand at it in a casino. I already know the basic principles such as tracking the count, converting to true count, adjusting a basic strategy based on the thresholds of those numbers, but I wanted something that gave me the ability to run simulations and see computed results, not necessarily rely on what a google search turned up as most popular and take it on blind faith.

    I think a handful of the features in cvcx are confusing me because they could be worded a little more clearly for newer players, like the 'insurance decks table' but it seems like just a short step / clarification away from being simple to understand. Was I right about this table simply being what the count min should be before taking insurance?

  5. #5


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    Quote Originally Posted by bjoe View Post
    Was I right about this table simply being what the count min should be before taking insurance?
    You're correct about the purpose of the table. You should go and read Professional Blackjack by Stanford Wong before you do anything else.

  6. #6


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    Quote Originally Posted by refinery View Post
    You're correct about the purpose of the table. You should go and read Professional Blackjack by Stanford Wong before you do anything else.

    Great book for the starting hi lo Player. Excellent reference for the experienced hi lo halves player.

  7. #7


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    I still refer to my autographed copy of Professional BJ to look up an oddball index after the day's play.

  8. #8


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    Quote Originally Posted by 21forme View Post
    I still refer to my autographed copy of Professional BJ to look up an oddball index after the day's play.
    As do I.

  9. #9


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    Quote Originally Posted by bjoe View Post
    Can someone explain how to populate this or how to understand it? What is it for in the Insurance/Counts tab and is it somehow tied to when insurance is worth taking? I cannot piece it together from the documentation.
    bjoe,

    If you want to take insurance at counts of +3 and up, then simply enter 3 into each of the eight boxes on the table.

    Norm provides this option because the insurance index may be different for, say, a SD game as compared to a 6D game: this is often the case for unbalanced counts.

    Hope this helps!

    Dog Hand

  10. #10


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    Aaaah, now I understand and remember it. The Vancura/Fuchs book, which treats the unbalanced KO count, normally assumes that the "Pivot Point" is +4 and the Insurance count is +3, which is also filled into the Insurance Decks Table in CV by default. However, as Vancura and Fuchs describe, it is easily possible to adjust the IRCs (Initial Running Counts) of the different deck numbers, so that not the Pivot Point is a fixed number, but the "Key Count" (normally +2 for Single Deck). I had to do this for my counting system, and to replace the +3 values by other ones in my Insurance Decks table. Now these values are really dependent on the number of decks. For a balanced count like Hi-Lo (which I don't use), I assume that the Insurance count is always +3, regardless of number of decks.
    Last edited by PinkChip; 08-24-2019 at 02:57 PM.

  11. #11
    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Actually, for HiLo, there is a minor difference because the ratio between aces and tens changes depending on the number of decks.
    "I don't think outside the box; I think of what I can do with the box." - Henri Matisse

  12. #12


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    Quote Originally Posted by Norm View Post
    Actually, for HiLo, there is a minor difference because the ratio between aces and tens changes depending on the number of decks.
    Which is why, if you side count aces in HiLo, and add/subtract 2 for each ace out of balance, it remains 3 in DD and SD.

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