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Thread: Technology and it’s advances..

  1. #27


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    Quote Originally Posted by nighterfighter View Post
    Well, now I am more confused, or I did a bad job of explaining what I was thinking. I'm really curious to know what you meant, as I'm still trying to learn. But, I understand if you don't want to say.

    You explained it fine - so here’s a clue for Counting us Fun. Opposition betting is part of the gambit.

  2. #28
    Senior Member bigplayer's Avatar
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    casinos can already do this, but thankfully it was ruled illegal in Nevada, a violation of the Device Statutes. Any system that can automatically count down a shoe must be on a delay so as to prevent the house from being able to order shuffles in real time based on swings in advantage. That doesn't mean a human can't use a computer to count you down up in surveillance (Bloodhound/BJ Survey Voice).

    For those thinking a more or less complex count system would enable them to somehow dodge a computer skills check, forget about it. These software programs don't use a count system at all, they use the actual Effects of Removal from Peter Griffin's "Theory of Blackjack" to determine your advantage and compares your betting patterns to the exact advantage. In the end, if you bet big when you have a big edge or bet small when you have no edge or sit out hands ($0) bet but stay at the table the computer will get you regardless of what system you ultimately are using. The operator isn't entering counts into the computer, instead he is entering the actual value of the cards hitting the table.

    You can delay the inevitable by using the various bet ramp design tricks described in many books, opposition betting, team play, consolidation betting, zone betting, etc. Or via advanced techniques like Ace Sequencing or Shuffle Tracking coupled with straight counting.
    Last edited by bigplayer; 07-15-2019 at 11:19 PM.

  3. #29


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    Quote Originally Posted by bigplayer View Post

    For those thinking a more or less complex count system would enable them to somehow dodge a computer skills check, forget about it. These software programs don't use a count system at all, they use the actual Effects of Removal from Peter Griffin's "Theory of Blackjack" to determine your advantage and compares your betting patterns to the exact advantage. In the end, if you bet big when you have a big edge or bet small when you have no edge or sit out hands ($0) bet but stay at the table the computer will get you regardless of what system you ultimately are using. The operator isn't entering counts into the computer, instead he is entering the actual value of the cards hitting the table.

    You can delay the inevitable by using the various bet ramp design tricks described in many books, opposition betting, team play, consolidation betting, zone betting, etc. Or via advanced techniques like Ace Sequencing or Shuffle Tracking coupled with straight counting.
    Essentially what I meant in post 22, except that bigplayers post articulates the point far better.

    To explain this further in simple terms, a hi lo player ignores the 7,8,9 for count purposes. The program alluded to ignores nothing. It pays close attention to hi lo proportions as well as proportions to intermediates, and evaluates advantage or disadvantage on that basis.

    Edited to remove bp’s first paragraph as well as to add everything beyond my first sentence.
    Last edited by Freightman; 07-16-2019 at 11:38 AM.

  4. #30


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    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeBabar View Post
    How far in the future is it that technology, in real time, can tell surveillance the count at each table on the floor and in HL rooms and on the floor?
    Actually Zee, this is a good question. I think you will find the technology already exist but the holdup is cost and the depreciation of existing equipment.

    Cost will continue to reduce until it is affordable for casinos to replace their old equipment. But they will not do this until they have full depreciated their exisiting equipment or they have been hit by losses and must plug the hole.

    Beware of new casinos who are selecting their surveillance equipment form the most recent and have no need to wait for anything to become obsolete.

    My prediction is that in the next ten years we will no longer have any anonymity due to facial recognition and card counting will be identified by the cameras and surveillance will be notified as if their toaster went off. I am fully aware that many have predicted the demise of the blackjack AP and perhaps there are some new and improved techniques, or unintended consequences, in the technologies that will offer some openings. I am not optimistic. Take a look at what the chinese are doing with facial recognition for a little preview.

    This phenom will do as all things seem to, evolve throughout the industry, starting first in the big new casinos and then morphing into the next level down and then the next until anyone not using such will be a unicorn.

    Even I hope I am wrong, but the trajectory of technological advances on top of exisiting technologies creates a persuasive argument.

    Can't wait to hear the blowback........
    Luck is nothing more than probability taken personally!

  5. #31


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    Quote Originally Posted by Stealth View Post
    Actually Zee, this is a good question. I think you will find the technology already exist but the holdup is cost and the depreciation of existing equipment.

    Cost will continue to reduce until it is affordable for casinos to replace their old equipment. But they will not do this until they have full depreciated their exisiting equipment or they have been hit by losses and must plug the hole.

    Beware of new casinos who are selecting their surveillance equipment form the most recent and have no need to wait for anything to become obsolete.

    My prediction is that in the next ten years we will no longer have any anonymity due to facial recognition and card counting ..
    Good to know that you don’t have a knee jerk reaction to anything I post.

    You will I’ll get some flak for saying it will happen in the next 10 years. Far too many were only recently persuaded to drop everything and become an AZp.

  6. #32


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    Quote Originally Posted by Freightman View Post
    Further, an analysis if actual remaining deck composition without regard to count used, which would be the one scaring me. The overall program would identify me as a poor quality counter, except for what I’ve just Suggested. I won’t elaborate more, as I want to give Counting Is Fun another opportunity to stick his foot in his mouth.
    Get the hell out of here you clown, and stop mentioning my name in a thread I am not even in. You think you will bully me off the forum? I haven't been a paid member for that long, but I have been a lurker for years and read years of the archives. Why can't you ever just stick to the thread?

  7. #33


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    Quote Originally Posted by Counting_Is_Fun View Post
    Get the hell out of here you clown, and stop mentioning my name in a thread I am not even in. You think you will bully me off the forum? I haven't been a paid member for that long, but I have been a lurker for years and read years of the archives. Why can't you ever just stick to the thread?
    What’s good for the goose must be good for the gander.

  8. #34


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    Quote Originally Posted by Freightman View Post
    What’s good for the goose must be good for the gander.
    What are you even talking about? It's obvious to anyone who has been here for a few years what your MO is.
    Sorry folks, I will do my best to just ignore Freightman and his juvenile nonsense and not engage. Good variance.
    Last edited by Counting_Is_Fun; 07-17-2019 at 08:55 PM.

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