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Thread: Any experience with BJA?

  1. #14


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    Quote Originally Posted by mcallister3200 View Post
    Having never been to one, the boot camps IMO are probably really only worth it for a very small segment, but for that segment it’s proven to provide value. Think they’re overpriced but they sell out so .....Someone with bankroll, decent skills but not a lot of experience (might know they have holes but probably have holes they’re unaware of it not) who wants to go all out and commit a lot of time to the endeavor and be their best (basically a full time pro.) Can cut years of time of things you would slowly learn on your own in the field, or avoid some costly mistakes (playing places that are national/regional network heat bombs). There’s people from that segment who go through them from any year that end up being six figure winners in short order. There are a couple people who play part time who started with boot camps and have made a few hundred thousand over the years that I’m aware of, just saying that’s not necessarily the segment I think it would provide the best value for.

    Forums are a less hostile environment than other forums as well as a better noise to quality ratio, just a function of pay vs free as well as Colin not hesitating to boot argumentative for no reason folk (dbs), each style has their benefits just different. The 411 (comparable to CBJN) is good and better than CBJN in a couple markets basically one time zone, most of the country it is not that good. Players being able to update it or add their own verbal commentary on their experiences in 411 are really good features that CBJN doesn’t have can give you a clue of tolerance levels at some properties that CBJN just really can’t do, along with just that everything bj21 related has gone downhill since the ownership change so it’s just another non private network info option.

    Haven’t really done the drills or course, so can’t comment on a comparison to say the bjinfo free course and cvbj drills.
    Just to set the record straight McAllister3200, Colin gave me a reason for kicking me off. He sent me two personal emails. He doesn’t like people who talk about tipping or in Zee’s case people who don’t treat the resident pros with reverence.

    I also don’t think Colin likes intelligent people who understand business and the casino’s business model. He seems to cater more to the naive and gullible crowd, who believe bj is the road to riches.

    And I think people who pay $3,000 for a day and a half bootcamp to learn Hilo would fit in the naive and guillable crowd. Lol

    Btw, do you by any chance get a commission from these bootcamps?
    Last edited by Dbs6582; 05-18-2019 at 09:27 AM.

  2. #15


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    I just said I think they’re overpriced, have never been there and only provide value for a small segment...so yea I get a commission...

    If someone on BJA said the sky was blue on that forum, you would argue it’s black because sometimes it’s dark out or storming. Bottom line you are just a troll and were booted because people there were choosing just not to participate rather than deal with your bs.
    Last edited by mcallister3200; 05-18-2019 at 09:47 AM.

  3. #16


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    Quote Originally Posted by mcallister3200 View Post
    I just said I think they’re overpriced, have never been there and only provide value for a small segment...so yea I get a commission...

    If someone on BJA said the sky was blue on that forum, you would argue it’s black because sometimes it’s dark out or storming.
    Not true. I only argue a point I believe in. For the most part, I believe casino’s are doing things right, so when APs attacked casinos, I usually came to their defense.

    And for the record several people on BJA liked my posts and commented they liked them. They said they liked the way I respectfully disagreed with someone and presented my opinion. They said they always learned from me. I was not sarcastic on that site and never called anybody names. I ageee BJA tried to be more thoughtful of others. It was a good forum.

    But I understand BJA is more like a cult site where Colin wants everybody to think the same way. It’s his site so he can run it the way he wants. I was okay getting kicked off. I have no hard feelings to Colin.

  4. #17


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    I recently met a new AP who went through the boot camp last year. He was very knowledgeable re running sims, evaluating games by N0, etc. Surprisingly knowledgeable for a newbie. He showed me one of his sims. Colin helped him set it up for specific game conditions, then emailed it to him.

    That said, anyone who is self-motivated should be able to accomplish the same skills on their own, though it may take a bit longer.

    Disclaimer - I've never been a member of BJA. I've met Colin once, in a casino.

  5. #18


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    I did far worse on other forums. I was very polite on the BJA Forum. I just got depressed by all the newbies who were quitting college or saving up to be a full time BJ player or planning to move to Las Vegas or where lots of casinos were. I kept pointing out that very few people can succeed at full time AP careers and that those who do have special skills. This was not appreciated by Colin and the pros there because they did not ant anyone to think they can fail.

  6. #19


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    Do they teach You of how to use CVCX?

  7. #20


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    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeBabar View Post
    Its like saying that paying $20 a month to a fitness club is a waste because you can always jog indoor or outdoors around your neighborhood and lift dumbells at home. True but some of us dont learn unless we pay for it.
    Zee is right when he said "some of us dont learn unless we pay for it" so evaluate yourself if you would rather pay $3k or listen to other posters. No one size fit all.

  8. #21


    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    The BJA forum and boot camp are two separate things.

    1) The forum is a paid-only membership and they only sell annual memberships. I’ve spoken to Colin and asked why he prefers that model and tbh, it makes sense. BJA used to have a free forum as well as a paid forum that could be purchased monthly. When Colin got rid of those options and moved exclusively to annual memberships, the number of trolls, bullshit posts, and non-serious posters went down tremendously. The BJA forum has a great supportive community. When you break down the annual membership cost monthly, it’s pennies! The BJA forum also grants you access to Casino 411, which is basically like CBJN. I also know Colin is working really hard right now to improve the quality of Casino 411 right now as we speak. So the membership price is definitely worth it in my opinion. I know when I was more active, I was paying more every month for my membership to BJ21 and CBJN. And I think those investments were worth every penny.

    2) As far as boot camp goes, that’s up to you. Yes, it’s expensive. As 21forme said, everything you can learn at boot camp can be learned on your own. I did it. But a boot camp will definitely accelerate the learning process. Also, the boot camp is much more than learning +1, -1. I know the boot camps help teach new players some of the nuances that many of us only learned through experience over the years. And boot camp will also help you expand your network, which I think is invaluable. Most of the guys who train at the boot camps are people who have played full time and have been in the trenches. It’s not just Colin teaching. There’s a group of “BJA Pros” that run the camp, along side with Colin. One of the more notable trainers at that camp is “Joe.” You might recognize him from GWAE. He did 3 interviews in total now. All of the BJA pros are there to answer your question, offer advice, trade war stories, etc, etc. There’s definitely some value in that, especially if you’re still green have now network.

    Another cool side note about the boot camp: Colin has been able to get a lot of great guest speakers to make an appearance at his camps. Last March, Tommy Hyland and Andy Bloch were there for a Q&A. Bob Dancer was there this past March as well. Late last year, Hyland was there again, along with Anthony Curtis. And if you were lucky enough to attend the boot camp in July of 2018, Colin had a party with many notable attendees: Tommy Hyland, Anthony Curtis, John Chang, Arnold Synder, poster bigplayer, Josh Axelrod, and a couple guys you might recognize from the Holy Rollers documentary. So my point is, you won’t get any of that by reading a book...
    Last edited by Ryemo; 05-19-2019 at 08:08 AM.

  9. #22


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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryemo View Post
    The BJA forum and boot camp are two separate things.

    1) The forum is a paid-only membership and they only sell annual memberships. I’ve spoken to Colin and asked why he prefers that model and tbh, it makes sense. BJA used to have a free forum as well as a paid forum that could be purchased monthly. When Colin got rid of those options and moved exclusively to annual memberships, the number of trolls, bullshit posts, and non-serious posters went down tremendously. The BJA forum has a great supportive community. When you break down the annual membership cost monthly, it’s pennies! The BJA forum also grants you access to Casino 411, which is basically like CBJN. I also know Colin is working really hard right now to improve the quality of Casino 411 right now as we speak. So the membership price is definitely worth it in my opinion. I know when I was more active, I was paying more every month for my membership to BJ21 and CBJN. And I think those investments were worth every penny.

    2) As far as boot camp goes, that’s up to you. Yes, it’s expensive. As 21forme said, everything you can learn at boot camp can be learned on your own. I did it. But a boot camp will definitely accelerate the learning process. Also, the boot camp is much more than learning +1, -1. I know the boot camps help teach new players some of the nuances that many of us only learned through experience over the years. And boot camp will also help you expand your network, which I think is invaluable. Most of the guys who train at the boot camps are people who have played full time and have been in the trenches. It’s not just Colin teaching. There’s a group of “BJA Pros” that run the camp, along side with Colin. One of the more notable trainers at that camp is “Joe.” You might recognize him from GWAE. He did 3 interviews in total now. All of the BJA pros are there to answer your question, offer advice, trade war stories, etc, etc. There’s definitely some value in that, especially if you’re still green have now network.
    Its like a venture run by, say pro basketball players. The problem is that just like some people have limitations that make it extremely unlikely they will end up making a living playing pro basketball, there are newbies lured to the site and camp, that simply cannot make a living playing BJ. This is not conveyed. You have people quitting their careers, quitting their jobs, borrowing money to join and learn, living with parents to get a bankroll and on and on. This is the sad part. Pro basketball is not for everyone, college is not for evefryone and neither is AP BJ. However, a voice of caution, of someone saying dont go full time until maybe 5 years after you start, etc. is banned. The forum is closely monitored and those who have had initial success report on it, those who fail are not represented. There is noone that shares that they saved up a $10,000 BR and lost it all.

  10. #23


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    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeBabar View Post
    Its like a venture run by, say pro basketball players. The problem is that just like some people have limitations that make it extremely unlikely they will end up making a living playing pro basketball, there are newbies lured to the site and camp, that simply cannot make a living playing BJ. This is not conveyed. You have people quitting their careers, quitting their jobs, borrowing money to join and learn, living with parents to get a bankroll and on and on. This is the sad part. Pro basketball is not for everyone, college is not for evefryone and neither is AP BJ. However, a voice of caution, of someone saying dont go full time until maybe 5 years after you start, etc. is banned. The forum is closely monitored and those who have had initial success report on it, those who fail are not represented. There is noone that shares that they saved up a $10,000 BR and lost it all.
    Zee, I agree with you on some or your points but not others. First off, it’s not hard. It’s not like you have to be really smart or have some special skill like an NBA player to do it. The problem is getting away with it, which is not taught on BJA.

    They encourage you to bomb away and play with no cover (betting or playing) and just expect a backoff and move on. This is the dumbest advice ever. This means to be a pro you have to be ready for a lot of travel and a non-normal life.

    Zee, where I agree with you is they teach it’s easy to make big money at blackjack and they appeal to the naïve and greedy. All you need to do is go to their homepage and see what their hook is.

    This is a quote on their homepage from apprentice member, Levinch, “It’s pretty awesome having financial freedom and a flexible job that I love. Thanks a ton.” In their promotional material, they talk about Joe making seven figures, and Colin making 600,000 and directing a team that made 4 million.

    They are preying on people’s greed and not accurately giving the downside of bj. If they are making so much money playing blackjack, why are they out there recruiting (thro their marketing material) and teaching it? We all know the more counters out there, the harder it is for all of us .

    To be clear, there is no direct dishonesty on their web site, but there sure is a lot of missleading information. We all know most people do not live in an area where they could make a living playing bj because the local casinos simply would not allow it, especially playing the way promoted by BJA. No Casinos gonna let you come in their place and just spread away and make $100,000 a year, year after year.

    I’ve got much more from Books than I got from that website. Arnold Snyder in his introductory chapter discusses in great length problems with becoming rich from bj. I found his statement that learning how to count is the easy part, getting away with it is the hard part, very accurate.

    The books explain variance in a way that is not totally explained on Blackjack apprenticeship. Anybody who complains about a losing streak on BJA is immediately told by the pros to go to the Bootcamp to get their game checked out.

    I have personally known a BJA member that has gone bust with a bankroll over $10,000. Obviously, he should’ve resized as his bankroll went down.

    When I was on BJA, I got several personal emails from members who lived close by and wanted to meet up. I never did because I have other things going on in my life, but what I noticed is most of them did not have good jobs. They were cooks or some other lower level job.

    It was sad seeing them believe their road to riches was thro Bj. Personally, I could never make money preying on these type of people.
    Last edited by Dbs6582; 05-19-2019 at 11:41 AM.

  11. #24


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    Those who can make that kind of money usually don’t teach others how to do it. More competition out there. Reminds me of an article about “Amazon gold” that everyone is trying To dig. 30K to hire a coach to start your shop on amazon. Don’t think most made any money, most of cut their losses by close the shop. Some even had to PAY amazon to DESTROY their merchandise.

    Those who can do, do. Those who can’t, teach.
    Aren’t the casinos or lottos best customers the poor, lower working class?

  12. #25


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    Also beware that if casinos tell you "Sorry Mr./Ms. X, you are too good for our BJ. We welcome you to play any other games"

  13. #26


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    "You get what you pay for."

    In this case you get nothing that is unavailable in many beginner's books.
    read Blackbelt in Blackjack by Snyder as a fine point to start.

    Go to https://www.betterworldbooks.com/sea...ack&p=4&hpp=12

    it will cost you $4.48
    Last edited by SkinnyBJplayer; 05-19-2019 at 01:10 PM.

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