See the top rated post in this thread. Click here

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 12

Thread: Player Banked games.

  1. #1


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No

    Player Banked games.

    x
    I live in central California.
    Is this so? - s'm'g I heard is possible in the Card Rooms.
    What is the deal with "player banked" card games?
    If I could somehow get my mitts on like $50,000 wouldn't
    this be a golden opportunity ? If not, why not?

  2. #2


    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Well you have to pay a fee to the casino, and you run the risk of being cheated and backed off, but yes there is probably some profit to be made especially on games with a high house edge.

  3. #3


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    The variance is also high. What if some player gets lucky hits a high payout wager like a royal flush and wins your entire bank? You have to pay.

    You will also have to be careful walking out to the parking lot. Everybody has seen your bankroll and I have heard of people getting robbed.

  4. #4


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Yes, there are good opportunities. As mentioned, very high variance due to payouts that pay multiple times the original wager.
    To go after the big money you need a 6 figure bank roll to sustain variance swings. If you are interested in making only $30-$40 an hour, this can be done banking low variance games with low limit wagers with about $30k/ROR under 3%.

    Most of these card rooms prefer a cashiers check to hold at cage if you bank the carnival games. There is positives and negatives in this. The upside is you can carry about $10k in actual cash to cover the majority of the payouts if needed, then when a large payout such as a royal flush hits they can tap into the check. Much safer but more verifiable records.

    If you decide to do this as a "business" banking continually for months many card rooms will require you to get a badge with Bureau of Gambling Control (Department of Justice). As far as I know this has not been challenged in the courts. If you refuse to obtain the badge, they may utilize their right to "refuse service" to you. There are a few card rooms like Commerce Casino located outside of Los Angeles that will find a way to ban bankers (Currently being sued). For the most part you wont have any issue on electing to bank from the card room itself. However, you will get an earful from other players at the table.

    Cheating by the card room itself is virtually non existent. Collusion between dealer and player is more likely but in my experience not common at all. Most of these card room dealers are making 6 figures or close to it. Because the state limits the numbers of tables they have, many games are constantly full with waiting list, creating good tipping opportunities for dealers. Most will think twice about cheating. Most card rooms have installed the machines that read the cards. Most have policies to where any payout over $500 is verified with the machine. It would be very difficult to "set up a royal flush" or another high payout hand with these machines.

    In an attempt to show their blackjack games are honest, they do allow players to "Buy Bet". This allows the player to play the Dealers hand and the banker makes the player decisions for the players hand (This is different that being the banker) The corporate bankers are instructed to play basic strategy on these hands. The player must also put up the amount equal to their wager in the event of a split/double down/or blackjack payout. The kicker is a 5% premium added to all buy bets. This option keeps the game honest, and with the 5% added premium per hand makes it a more profitable bet for the banker.

    So Yes, ultimately good opportunity but requires thick skin and a stomach of steel to handle variance swings. Even a CCW is a good idea.
    Last edited by BankerCA; 05-11-2019 at 10:00 AM.

  5. #5


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    BankerCA, Kind of off topic but what is your experience counting in card rooms? Is there heat, are there backoffs, is it case-by-case basis? Etc. Yes I know most are 6:5 but the key word here is “most”.

  6. #6


    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by Tetn1s View Post
    BankerCA, Kind of off topic but what is your experience counting in card rooms? Is there heat, are there backoffs, is it case-by-case basis? Etc.
    Heat and backoffs are very rare in a cardroom. You must keep in mind since you are not playing against the "house", the outcome of the game is not much of a concern to them. They understand that the blackjack game they offer is hard to beat without a significant bankroll. I have never seen a player even attempt to count these games. The only motivation for a back off would be pressure from their banking corporation. In addition to the collection, the card rooms have very lucrative contracts with the third party banking group to cover action when no players elect to hold the bank, which is virtually always.

    Another forum member who was on Gambling With An Edge talks about his experience counting in a card room. If I recall correctly his top bet was 2x$5000 and they welcomed his action, as they think its unbeatable or not worth your time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tetn1s View Post
    Yes I know most are 6:5 but the key word here is “most”.
    Every Card Room in the State that I am aware of is 6:5. They have to have a high edge game in order to cover the collection rake per round and enough EV in it to make it feasible for the banking corporation.
    Last edited by BankerCA; 05-09-2019 at 11:17 PM.

  7. #7


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Banker, do card rooms use CSM's to shuffle blackjack games or are they hand-shuffled?

  8. #8


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by BankerCA View Post
    Another forum member who was on Gambling With An Edge talks about his experience counting in a card room.
    If I recall correctly his top bet was 2x$5000 and they welcomed his action, as they think its unbeatable or not worth your time.
    x
    I will search online for Gambling With an Edge, but as a Californian, born and bred, $5,000 sounds like hyperbole. I am thinking $500.

  9. #9


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by SkinnyBJplayer View Post
    I will search online for Gambling With an Edge, but as a Californian, born and bred, $5,000 sounds like hyperbole. I am thinking $500.
    It is 5k. Its a member here that had a 7 figure bankroll. Most Card rooms have a $500 max. There are card rooms in the Los Angeles area that have $5,000 max bets.



    Quote Originally Posted by 2Bornot2B View Post
    Banker, do card rooms use CSM's to shuffle blackjack games or are they hand-shuffled?
    For the sake of this discussion ASM (Automatic Shuffle machine) shuffles the deck not currently in play vs. CSM (Continuous Shuffle machine) Combination automatic shuffler and dealing shoe.

    They have 2 decks they rotate. The cards are dealt from a shoe. When the shoe deck is complete they take the freshly shuffled deck from the ASM and place it in the shoe, then the other deck gets shuffled by the ASM while the current round is being played.

  10. #10


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by BankerCA View Post
    Yes, there are good opportunities. As mentioned, very high variance due to payouts that pay multiple times the original wager.
    To go after the big money you need a 6 figure bank roll. If you are interested in making only $30-$40 an hour, this can be done banking low variance games with low limit wagers with about $30k/ROR under 3%.

    Most of these card rooms prefer a cashiers check to hold at cage if you bank the carnival games. There is positives and negatives in this. The upside is you can carry about $10k in actual cash to cover the majority of the payouts if needed, then when a large payout such as a royal flush hits they can tap into the check. Much safer but more verifiable records.

    If you decide to do this as a "business" banking continually for months many card rooms will require you to get a badge with Bureau of Gambling Control (Department of Justice). As far as I know this has not been challenged in the courts. If you refuse to obtain the badge, they may utilize their right to "refuse service" to you. There are a few card rooms like Commerce Casino located outside of Los Angeles that will find a way to ban bankers (Currently being sued). For the most part you wont have any issue on electing to bank from the card room itself. However, you will get an earful from other players at the table.

    Cheating by the card room itself is virtually non existent. Collusion between dealer and player is more likely but in my experience not common at all. Most of these card room dealers are making 6 figures or close to it. Because the state limits the numbers of tables they have, many games are constantly full with waiting list, creating good tipping opportunities for dealers. Most will think twice about cheating. Most card rooms have installed the machines that read the cards. Most have policies to where any payout over $500 is verified with the machine. It would be very difficult to "set up a royal flush" or another high payout hand with these machines.

    In an attempt to show their blackjack games are honest, they do allow players to "Buy Bet". This allows the player to play the Dealers hand and the banker makes the player decisions for the players hand (This is different that being the banker) The corporate bankers are instructed to play basic strategy on these hands. The player must also put up the amount equal to their wager in the event of a split/double down/or blackjack payout. The kicker is a 5% premium added to all buy bets. This option keeps the game honest, and with the 5% added premium per hand makes it a more profitable bet for the banker.

    So Yes, ultimately good opportunity but requires thick skin and a stomach of steel to handle variance swings. Even a CCW is a good idea.

    Do you know if it's actually possible to get this badge and continue banking if they ban you?

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 3
    Last Post: 01-21-2018, 12:39 PM
  2. California player banked games
    By beta in forum General Blackjack Forum
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 04-20-2017, 10:11 AM
  3. ET Fan: More on poker and n-player games
    By ET Fan in forum Blackjack Main
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 10-25-2003, 09:52 PM
  4. Small Player: Best Games in Vegas?
    By Small Player in forum Blackjack Main
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 08-02-2002, 07:46 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

About Blackjack: The Forum

BJTF is an advantage player site based on the principles of comity. That is, civil and considerate behavior for the mutual benefit of all involved. The goal of advantage play is the legal extraction of funds from gaming establishments by gaining a mathematic advantage and developing the skills required to use that advantage. To maximize our success, it is important to understand that we are all on the same side. Personal conflicts simply get in the way of our goals.