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Thread: When do I start attracting attention?

  1. #1


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    When do I start attracting attention?

    First my background: the first time I ever walked into a casino was two years ago. The next was 18 months ago. About a year ago, I started going more frequently. At about that time, I studied basic strategy (Wizard of Odds) for my preferred game - Spanish 21, H17, Redoubling allowed. Over the past year, I found that I could do just better than break even just using basic strategy and the comps provided by the casino. Last week, I bought Katarina Walker’s book and stared counting. I limit myself to a $200 bankroll, only buying in for $100 initially and I play on $3 and $5 tables. My bets range from one hand at $3 to three at $20, so I am not extacly a “high roller.” I will Wong out when TC gets below about -7 (natural TC for Spanish is -4). My biggest single day was just a few days ago $600 in 5 hours. I consider myself a student at this point and am not willing to risk much. I’m not trying to go pro; I just like to win.

    I figured that at these small dollar amounts and playing Spanish, I would not attract attention. However, this morning, a dealer cut a shoe with 60% penetration instead of his typical 80%. As did the next.

    Am I really attracting attention at this point, or is this just my imagination?
    Last edited by Splitting Tens; 04-19-2019 at 03:17 PM.

  2. #2


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    Quote Originally Posted by Splitting Tens View Post
    However, this morning, a dealer cut a shoe with 40% penetration instead of his typical 20%. As did the next.
    Then you are still attracting heat. If a store have $3 and $5 minimum it is a dump. They will put countermeasure on you but unlikely to back you off just yet . As i said that place( probably some little joint in Washington ) is a dump.

  3. #3


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    Quote Originally Posted by Splitting Tens View Post
    I figured that at these small dollar amounts and playing Spanish, I would not attract attention. However, this morning, a dealer cut a shoe with 40% penetration instead of his typical 20%. As did the next.

    Am I really attracting attention at this point, or is this just my imagination?
    You are really new. Everybody else defines the penetration from the first card to the cut card. You did from from the cut card to the last card. You should say the dealer changed the penetration from the typical 80% to 60%.

  4. #4


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    Quote Originally Posted by stopgambling View Post
    If a store have $3 and $5 minimum it is a dump.
    That sums it up well.

  5. #5


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    Quote Originally Posted by BJGenius007 View Post
    You are really new. Everybody else defines the penetration from the first card to the cut card. You did from from the cut card to the last card. You should say the dealer changed the penetration from the typical 80% to 60%.
    I fully and freely admit I am new. There is a reason that I am on the cheap tables: Only a fool would bet large sums of money when they don’t know squat. I am convinced that I know more than 99% of the folks I see at the tables, though: I am actively working in learning the game and playing at a slight advantage while the players around me blow through thousands they can’t afford.

  6. #6


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    Quote Originally Posted by stopgambling View Post
    Then you are still attracting heat. If a store have $3 and $5 minimum it is a dump. They will put countermeasure on you but unlikely to back you off just yet . As i said that place( probably some little joint in Washington ) is a dump.
    Define “dump” as it pertains to casinos.

    I chose this location as my “training” casino as it’s close to home, has a cheap table, and a house edge below .4% It does not have continuous shuffling machines.

    I’m a little surprised that they’d worry about some schmuck who is happy with a $200 score...

  7. #7


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    what i know a " dump" is a low action joint that can not afford to lose and sweat every bit of action . They usually have dealers calling out check play at $25 . My post is not intended to belittle you . i have played at dumps when i was starting out. Some dumps can take more action than you think.

  8. #8


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    Quote Originally Posted by Splitting Tens View Post
    I’m a little surprised that they’d worry about some schmuck who is happy with a $200 score...
    If you are counting then maybe .

  9. #9


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    @stopgambling
    No offense was taken. I'm simply new to the blackjack world and don't know the vernacular yet.

    I'm at a point where I can count accurately (under decent conditions), know basic strategy well (for the one set of rules I've been playing) and am starting to vary my bets with the count while learning a handful of indices to adjust my actual play at different counts. I do need to improve my ability to keep the count while playing with more meddling table mates (drunk, chiding me for certain "book" plays, blaming me for ruining a shoe, being angry that I don't bet the side wagers, etc.) It's also clear that I need to start implementing more camouflage than I had expected at this point. I had two sessions yesterday. In one, I felt zero heat and penetration was typically close to 90%. The counting went well and, as I expanded to two or three hands with higher wagers (TC +1 and +2 in a game where the natural TC is -4), the high cards all came out. Unfortunately, I kept getting stiffs while everybody around me (including the dealer) got twenties and blackjacks. I lost about $250. In the second session, the counting continued to go well and I got up about $400 pretty quickly. I then started seeing the penetration go to 60% and, the few times the count got healthy, the cards did not land right. I especially hated the hand where I got three 20's and the dealer drew blackjack. I finished the day a little better than $50 ahead. I would have left earlier in the second session, but I really am still practicing and I wanted to work on my play while surrounded by obnoxious fools - which were plentiful last night.

  10. #10


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    Quote Originally Posted by Splitting Tens View Post
    I'm at a point where I can count accurately (under decent conditions), know basic strategy well
    That is enough for stores you are frequent to take notice and counter measures. I am light green player but 2 local places backed me off. Couple months ago they reduced my comps and watch my play more. I did not notice that but "rewind" my memory I think they let me know I am under their "radars".

  11. #11


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    Quote Originally Posted by cc12b View Post
    That is enough for stores you are frequent to take notice and counter measures. I am light green player but 2 local places backed me off. Couple months ago they reduced my comps and watch my play more. I did not notice that but "rewind" my memory I think they let me know I am under their "radars".
    I noticed that my comps are up since I started raising my wagers. I have seen the bosses watch my play a little more and have intentionally made a few stupid plays or altered my bets in odd ways for them, so I don't think the management as pegged me as a counter *yet,* but that a couple of savvy dealers have suspicions. However, if they keep watching, I suppose they'll change their minds eventually - I can't make stupid plays every hand.

    My largest wagers last night were $20 on three hands at a $5 table. Am I likely to face more heat than disadvantageous penetration at this level?

  12. #12


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    Quote Originally Posted by Splitting Tens View Post
    Am I likely to face more heat than disadvantageous penetration at this level?
    There is no one size fits all as each casino/pb has different level of skill or tolerance. Like ZMF said "there is no heat until it burn you". Not exact wording but the meaning is understood.

  13. #13


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    Quote Originally Posted by cc12b View Post
    There is no one size fits all as each casino/pb has different level of skill or tolerance. Like ZMF said "there is no heat until it burn you". Not exact wording but the meaning is understood.
    I won $13,500 recently and I don’t count cards rather I only pay attention to certain patterns and use basic strategy



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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