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Thread: Hand shuffle

  1. #1


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    Hand shuffle

    Something weird happened to me today. The dealer said that he could hand shuffle because I was saying the ASMs were making losing hands. I know it’s all voodoo but is it better to have a hand shuffle or ASM. I would think an ASM for speed reasons but if you’re STing obviously Hand shuffle is better

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    I don't believe in ASM cheating but I still like a hand shuffle so I have no doubts. I get to play some hand shuffles but mostly ASMs. The most suspicious array of cards always seem to be on the hand shuffle for some reason. But I know I wasn't being cheated.

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    Three, I always seem to think the ASMs have the weirdest draws of cards especially at very high counts. The pairings just seem off but it could be selective memory just like you always bust hitting 12 vs 2

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    Quote Originally Posted by winnawinna View Post
    Three, I always seem to think the ASMs have the weirdest draws of cards especially at very high counts. The pairings just seem off but it could be selective memory just like you always bust hitting 12 vs 2
    The evilest thing that ASM do is to make clump of six or eight aces far away from any face card to reduce player BJ rate by 25% or 33% in the 6D game. The second evilest thing that ASM do is to pair lots of two's and face cards together to help ploppies and hurt Basic Strategy players and counters.

    When I got BJ two or three per hour (should be 4.8 under normal circumstance) and kept getting face card or two when I hit 12 v 2, I strongly suspect ASM is clumping, or am I that unlucky.

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    If you get an idea in your head you will notice when it happens and give it more power than it should be given. I just don't get to play many hand shuffles so that smaller sampling just seems crazier. Of course I know it isn't. I remember making a bunch of money on a hand shuffle that had a huge ace clump. There was like 3 decks worth of aces in 1/2 to 3/4 deck slug. It took almost 4 hours to break the clump up. I was really amazed each shuffle that the ace clump stayed more or less intact. It was probably getting other aces put back in. Once they started showing up I just cranked my bet. I was grateful for how long the clump lasted. But when it finally broke up I was a bit bummed out. Every time I here about T clumping with ASMs all I can think of is how do Ts not clump. They make up almost 1/3rd of the deck. I saw half the cards of one rank, or half of 1/13th of the shoe clump for almost 4 hours in a hand shuffled game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Three View Post
    If you get an idea in your head you will notice when it happens and give it more power than it should be given. I just don't get to play many hand shuffles so that smaller sampling just seems crazier. Of course I know it isn't. I remember making a bunch of money on a hand shuffle that had a huge ace clump. There was like 3 decks worth of aces in 1/2 to 3/4 deck slug. It took almost 4 hours to break the clump up. I was really amazed each shuffle that the ace clump stayed more or less intact. It was probably getting other aces put back in. Once they started showing up I just cranked my bet. I was grateful for how long the clump lasted. But when it finally broke up I was a bit bummed out. Every time I here about T clumping with ASMs all I can think of is how do Ts not clump. They make up almost 1/3rd of the deck. I saw half the cards of one rank, or half of 1/13th of the shoe clump for almost 4 hours in a hand shuffled game.
    I also have another great indicator. Unlike BJanalyst's counting system which counts eight's and nine's but cancelled by face cards and aces, I side count eight and nine in an independent number. When I play at ASM tables, this number becomes extremely volatile compared to that is presented in hand-shuffled games. For example, the number is in +5/-5 range 75% or 80% of the time when I play hand-shuffled. But the number spiked to very high (like above +10) or very negative (like below -10) in high frequency at ASM table. The explanation is that either dealers did a poor job to shuffle cards and somewhat it clumps cards or ASM purposely clump eight's and nine's in close vicinity.

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    I know someone that would adjust his game very well for the extreme surplus and deficit of eights and nines. I don't track them. But I think BJanalyst's count balanced faces against 8,9, and 2 times the A. I wasn't sure about that but it seemed to be the only logical thing for what he was doing. AA89mTc, the m stood for minus. The 4 before the m where counted plus 1 each balanced by the 4 T ranks as minus one.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BJGenius007 View Post

    I strongly suspect ASM is clumping, or am I that unlucky.
    During my very recent last trip of the year, DEALT FROM AN ASM - The moon was in the 7th hour and Jupiter aligned with Mars. Accordingly, I chipped up beyond my higher ramp max bet - for the biggest shoe of my career.

    https://youtu.be/ajgeaOt_HTQ

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    Depends if they wash the cards. Some places don't wash the cards, but I prefer a hand shuffle if the cards are washed.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWeCJMiIb1w
    Last edited by Midwest Player; 12-27-2018 at 09:14 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Midwest Player View Post
    Depends if they wash the cards. Some places don't wash the cards, but I prefer a hand shuffle if the cards are washed.
    In many jurisdictions it is illegal to not wash the cards when fresh cards are brought in.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Freightman View Post
    The moon was in the 7th hour and Jupiter aligned with Mars.
    LoL.
    Maybe some of you already guessed, but I am about as Aquarius as you can get. I was born during a planetary alignment with the moon and most of the planets in Aquarius. That is what the song is about. I don't put much stock in that stuff, but Aquarius really describe me well. Probably a coincidence.

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    Machine vs. hand, the difference is this:

    A hand shuffle is real; it's a traditional* shuffle as prescribed in the most ancient books of Hoyle. It doesn't produce a completely different or completely random sequence of cards each time the dealer shuffles, no, it produces a "shuffled" deck. Players should watch the dealer's hands to ensure the deck(s) get shuffled enough for the players' satisfaction, and that they don't get cheated. Remember, players should be part of each step in the game.

    The machines on the other hand do not shuffle. They rearrange and re-order the cards to a given prescribed sequence. They electronically read each card going in, by suit and denomination, record where it is located, and then rebuild a new sequence based on the recipe order preconceived by the computer. The computer has many examples of sequences, each claiming to be a representation of a random order. This new sequence being built slips by the gaming control board because it is supposedly representative of a random sequence of cards. But some examples of random sequences are more beneficial to the player,* others more beneficial to the house. Which examples of sequences would the house prefer to build?*
    Pit bosses can select a setting on the machine to change the extent of the rearrangement. You may see them do this when the number of filled seats at the table change.* The machines rearrange the cards inside a black box, so the players cannot see if, or rather the extent to which, they are being cheated.*

    One pit boss in Philadelphia flipped the switch the wrong way,* and the machine took a used mixed-up deck and rearranged it into a factory-fresh new-deck order, and in the next couple rounds all players were getting Straights and Flushes! The casino was fined months later, but not enough.*

    I would ban all electronic machines from this game. If players cannot legally use a machine to read the cards, then the house should not be allowed to use such machines.
    Ole

    Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ole View Post
    I would ban all electronic machines from this game. If players cannot legally use a machine to read the cards, then the house should not be allowed to use such machines.
    Ole
    I don't agree with a lot of what you said but I agree with this. If it is assumed an electronic device in the possession of the player will be used as a cheating device (no cell phones at the table, no cameras, etc), then it should be assumed the casino will use any electronic device to cheat and not allow them to use any. Why should the casinos be viewed as trustworthy when the players aren't? I don't think history merits that assumption.

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