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Thread: Factoring FREE PLAY into RoR

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    Factoring FREE PLAY into RoR

    How would I factor in free play when calculating RoR?

    For example, playing a game with 1% player edge, and after every 500 hands played, I receive $100 in free play
    May the Variance be with you.

  2. #2


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    Quote Originally Posted by blueman View Post
    How would I factor in free play when calculating RoR?

    For example, playing a game with 1% player edge, and after every 500 hands played, I receive $100 in free play
    Why Bother. Your 100 free play is worth less than your edge of 1%, ergo, it’s less than a buck, since I think most joints will only pay even on blackjack.

    Now, if you want to treat the 100 as 100 profit, then 500 times your average bet - let’s say 100, multiply by your edge, add the 100 free play and recalculate your edge.

    500x100=50000x1%=500+100=600. Edge is now 1.2%. Now, make your ROR calculation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Freightman View Post
    Why Bother. Your 100 free play is worth less than your edge of 1%, ergo, it’s less than a buck, since I think most joints will only pay even on blackjack.
    $100 in free play is worth way more than a buck if you use it on video poker.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Freightman View Post
    Why Bother. Your 100 free play is worth less than your edge of 1%, ergo, it’s less than a buck, since I think most joints will only pay even on blackjack.

    Now, if you want to treat the 100 as 100 profit, then 500 times your average bet - let’s say 100, multiply by your edge, add the 100 free play and recalculate your edge.

    500x100=50000x1%=500+100=600. Edge is now 1.2%. Now, make your ROR calculation.
    How do you figure the $100 free play to be worth $100??

    Don

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    Quote Originally Posted by DSchles View Post
    How do you figure the $100 free play to be worth $100??

    Don
    I don’t. It’s clearly implied that if he should wish to treat it as $100......... Further, Ive clearly stated my thoughts on its value, ergo it’s minimal effect on ROR.

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    Discount it since it’s based on future goodwill of the casino that will dry up at some point.

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    If this is machine free play, there are plenty of different types of plays, slots and video poker, where the overall return is greater than 100%.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Freightman View Post
    Why Bother. Your 100 free play is worth less than your edge of 1%, ergo, it’s less than a buck, since I think most joints will only pay even on blackjack.

    Now, if you want to treat the 100 as 100 profit, then 500 times your average bet - let’s say 100, multiply by your edge, add the 100 free play and recalculate your edge.

    500x100=50000x1%=500+100=600. Edge is now 1.2%. Now, make your ROR calculation.
    Yes i just count free play as cash. I didnt know if just factoring in to your over all edge was the same because its guaranteed AV vs EV..

    The numbers i used was an example.

    So, lets say im playing NSUD 99.73% payback, and after every $10,000 coin in they give me $100 cash. Do i simply just caluclate my ror using a player edge of 0.73% (with game payback now of 100.73%)

    The $100 cash they give me is AV not EV.. but that doesnt matter i can just say the game gives back 100.73%?

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    Quote Originally Posted by blueman View Post
    Yes i just count free play as cash. I didnt know if just factoring in to your over all edge was the same because its guaranteed AV vs EV..

    The numbers i used was an example.

    So, lets say im playing NSUD 99.73% payback, and after every $10,000 coin in they give me $100 cash. Do i simply just caluclate my ror using a player edge of 0.73% (with game payback now of 100.73%)

    The $100 cash they give me is AV not EV.. but that doesn't matter i can just say the game gives back 100.73%?
    Essentially, yes. The one inconsequential difference is that you have an e.v. of $9,973, which is subject to variance. After $10,000 coin in, your result could be anything. But the $100 is guaranteed and isn't subject to variance. You will have that with certainty (unless the casino reneges on its promise).

    Don

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    Quote Originally Posted by DSchles View Post
    Essentially, yes. The one inconsequential difference is that you have an e.v. of $9,973, which is subject to variance. After $10,000 coin in, your result could be anything. But the $100 is guaranteed and isn't subject to variance. You will have that with certainty (unless the casino reneges on its promise).

    Don
    Exactly my dilemma! So how would that affect RoR, being that the $100 is guaranteed? I would think that it would lower it. Just not sure how to run numbers. Essentially trying to find the roll needed to play this game infinitely and comparing RoRs

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