Hand shuffle

[BJGenius007]

Machine vs. hand, the difference is this:

A hand shuffle is real; it's a traditional* shuffle as prescribed in the most ancient books of Hoyle. It doesn't produce a completely different or completely random sequence of cards each time the dealer shuffles, no, it produces a "shuffled" deck. Players should watch the dealer's hands to ensure the deck(s) get shuffled enough for the players' satisfaction, and that they don't get cheated. Remember, players should be part of each step in the game.

The machines on the other hand do not shuffle. They rearrange and re-order the cards to a given prescribed sequence. They electronically read each card going in, by suit and denomination, record where it is located, and then rebuild a new sequence based on the recipe order preconceived by the computer. The computer has many examples of sequences, each claiming to be a representation of a random order. This new sequence being built slips by the gaming control board because it is supposedly representative of a random sequence of cards. But some examples of random sequences are more beneficial to the player,* others more beneficial to the house. Which examples of sequences would the house prefer to build?*
Pit bosses can select a setting on the machine to change the extent of the rearrangement. You may see them do this when the number of filled seats at the table change.* The machines rearrange the cards inside a black box, so the players cannot see if, or rather the extent to which, they are being cheated.*

You are my savior.

[ZeeBabar]

Watch out, this thread will get shut down or moved elsewhere.

[BoSox]

Machine vs. hand, the difference is this:

A hand shuffle is real; it's a traditional* shuffle as prescribed in the most ancient books of Hoyle. It doesn't produce a completely different or completely random sequence of cards each time the dealer shuffles, no, it produces a "shuffled" deck. Players should watch the dealer's hands to ensure the deck(s) get shuffled enough for the players' satisfaction, and that they don't get cheated. Remember, players should be part of each step in the game.

The machines on the other hand do not shuffle. They rearrange and re-order the cards to a given prescribed sequence. They electronically read each card going in, by suit and denomination, record where it is located, and then rebuild a new sequence based on the recipe order preconceived by the computer. The computer has many examples of sequences, each claiming to be a representation of a random order. This new sequence being built slips by the gaming control board because it is supposedly representative of a random sequence of cards. But some examples of random sequences are more beneficial to the player,* others more beneficial to the house.

Very good post. I am curious what Norm thinks of the post up to where I quoted, specifically if he thinks the players are getting a truly random shuffle?

[BJGenius007]

Very good post. I am curious what Norm thinks of the post up to where I quoted, specifically if he thinks the players are getting a truly random shuffle?

So the new theory is that as long as the ASM gave favorable decks to balance harmful decks, ASM can pass the randomness certification process and gambling commissions OK it?

[BoSox]

So the new theory is that as long as the ASM gave favorable decks to balance harmful decks, ASM can pass the randomness certification process and gambling commissions OK it?

That sounds about right first we have to trust that a machine is arranging the cards randomly without any chance for future alteration of any kind. But we also have to trust gaming commissions as overseers to keep everything legitimate, wonderful.

[BJGenius007]

That sounds about right first we have to trust that a machine is arranging the cards randomly without any chance for future alteration of any kind. But we also have to trust gaming commissions as overseers to keep everything legitimate, wonderful.

My beef with the theory is that there are no favorable decks that ASM can generate to help counters and Basic Strategy players. Truly random decks are the best they can get from ASM.

[BoSox]

My beef with the theory is that there are no favorable decks that ASM can generate to help counters and Basic Strategy players. Truly random decks are the best they can get from ASM.

Bottom line, if there is any type of preconceived arrangement of cards by a machine would be a far cry from being truly random. At least that is how I look at it.

[blueman]

Do we have proof that machines clump cards? I'll ive heard so fast are opinions.

[stopgambling]

I'll ive heard so fast are opinions.

"All I have heard so far are opinions" , Is this what you really meant?

[Ole]

Do we have proof that machines clump cards? I'll ive heard so fast are opinions.

We do have legal proof of related infractions.
We have proof that the shuffle machines can and do control the order and sequence of the cards, and that the type of such a sequence produced can be selected by a switch accessible to the casino management,*and that such machines can often deal to customers "illigitimate decks" as denoted in the legal suit documents against a casino that were written by the Pennsylvania Gaming Control Board, which was reported by the Philadelphia Inquirer newspaper in October.

Ole


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