Ive noticed this too but only at certain vegas casinos. Mainly off the strip and downtown. I first thought it could be that they are a dual rate dealer/pit so they know the signs of a counter.Originally Posted by 21forme
But i think its more likely that they are just dealers who have dealt at the same place a long time and maybe have been taught to do that as part of their job. It tends to be the older female dealers who ive experienced it with, most likely lifers.
No I am not but there are cultural differences that anyone that is observant would notice within every group. I know what to expect. I am pleased when I am pleasantly surprised. If you don't know about different cultures you just aren't worldly enough. Once a generation removed from their country of heritage many become americanized and adopt more of our culture. Part of the strength of diversity is understanding and respecting other cultures. Acting like you don't see and embrace cultural differences is disrespectful of their culture and heritage. In many traditional asian cultures women have a different role than they have in our culture. I can understand and respect that. When I get an Asian female dealer that barely speaks English, as is very common in many casinos around here, I know what to expect to happen most of the time. They seem very focused on serving the casino at the expense of serving their customers to earn tips. Most dealers understand that tips are based on serving their customers and know that is where most of their pay comes from and act accordingly. I will leave it to the Asian ladies here to explain what the culture they came from and may still choose to embrace is like. I respect their culture and their choice. I don't deny it or judge it.
Then those dealers go through a short extension of on the job training by Three himself. Upon completion of training, these dealers turn into something like the following that he explained earlier in the week when someone attempts to Wong in on his table.
"The dealer has to take their action for them to come in. Many will just push their bet back and keep dealing saying he is going to finish the shoe alone. They know it is worth their while to do so. If the person complains a good dealer lammers up the empty spots saying they forgot to reserve them when the people asked upon leaving. It really pays to take care of the dealers. Of course that doesn't always happen but the dealers I frequent do lots of little things to help me out, especially if they know the player trying to come in is a stiff. I have ploppies that will lammer up spots for me as well. They join at the beginning of the next shoe. It is a freeroll for them. If things go well I take care of them. If not they always want to play my side bet as compensation. Apparently I am lucky at the side bets. I just think it is selective memory on their part."
So you are equating what you do to shoplifting? A better analogy is would be a waitress that had a guy order the all you can eat crab dinner for $50 decide to give poor service because she thinks he has already had too many crabs. The guy isn't breaking any laws by eating the crabs he can eat. The restaurant put it on the menu and this guy just ate more crabs than the ones that get tired of picking crabs after eating less than a half dozen of them. Nobody ever fills up on crabs. They just get tired of picking them.
You can't train every dealer. But you don't have to play at tables with dealers you don't like and can choose to play at tables with dealers you like. So you can close to do most of your play with dealers that make playing as pleasant as possible. If you haven't develop table skills to work dealers and ploppies you are leaving a lot of EV on the table. I know of people that swear they were being cheated by the dealer. After losing every hand for 10 minutes one put out a tip for the dealer and won. He jokingly commented that if he knew that all he had to do was tip to win he would tip every hand. The dealer leans in a whispers that he had better hurry because his shift is over in 15 minutes. He tipped every round and won every hand for the rest of his shift. The guy was obviously a mechanic and was making the stiffs lose so he could let the tippers win and have things even out while lining his pocket.
Most dealers are in it for themselves and few see anything good happening to them from helping the house. Most dealers hate their employer. Why should they want to help the casino? They get nothing out of it. Giving players what makes them happy can result in extra money in their pocket. Most dealers try to figure out how to make each player want to tip. If they can figure that out they will give you what they are comfortable giving you as long as they know they will get some. This is true with every player sitting at the table. All most dealers want is to hit that trigger that will make any of them tip. One of my favorite dealers leaned in and apologized for cutting as thick as he did explaining the big brass were in the casino today so that is the best he could do. I was amused because the cut was still so much better than any other dealer that I didn't even think anything was wrong. He knew what he could get away with and that I would tip small but regular for being made a happy camper. And if I won a lot I would also give a decent tip upon leaving. He really wanted that bigger tip and did what he could to make it more likely I would be in a position to do it. The Floor always thanked me for taking care of his boys. Most of the suits started as dealers and are much more tolerant of tippers and quick to act against stiffs.
I was playing and getting cuts so shitty I was thinking of waiting for the next shift to play another shoe. Then the dealer that had been cutting so bad cut real thin one time. I put a tip out right away. Then the next shoe was cut real thin. I put a tip out right away again. In the middle of the shoe the relief dealer that had been cutting even worse came in. The dealer whispered into the reliefs ear. That relief dealer also cut real thin. From that point on they cut thin every time I played with either of them. You can train a dog with treats because he wants that treat. Most dealers are almost as smart as the dog so you should be able to train them with treats as well. I never tried bringing a clicker to the table to click when they did what I wanted them to do right before I put out a tip. LoL
I don't have a problem being a stiff for a dealer that is untrainable. But giving the dealer a taste of the extra EV they allow me to have is a wise move if it ensures the EV. I had a dealer with a bad habit of looking for BJ before asking for insurance. It was obvious by the way insurance was asked for whether there was a T in the hole. A few others pulled cards prematurely and would get a look at them. They obviously did this to hustle tips by helping players win. You just had to know how to get the information. I asked one guy what the card was and he said he can't tell me. I asked if he could give me a hint. He said it looks just like that card while pointing at my 3. The dealer had a 6 up so I hit my 13. The dealer flipped a T and hit an 8 to bust what would have been a made 19. One dealer would make misdeals ad when a ploppy would point it out prematurely he would say don't say anything yet. Let me finish dealing the cards so you get a better option. With no skill for working a dealer and their eccentricities I would have been way behind where I usually am. Why wouldn't I choose to play at one of my favorite dealers tables rather than play where the cut sucks and the dealers seem to be hoping I will lose and doing what they can to make sure it happens.
I've found most dealers don't care or don't know. Some side with the house and rat on you and give horrible pen. Most just do their job daydreaming about whatever the heck they think about all day. The rare few know what's up enough to give exceptional pen. Most dealers who call me out on counting are just bored and want to seem smart. They don't actually go anywhere with it. I've heard of dealers preferentially shuffling, but I've only suspected it once. I don't frequent the rural Nevada places it seems to occur.
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