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Thread: Did I do it wrong?

  1. #1


    1 out of 5 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No

    Did I do it wrong?

    In 6 deck H17 standard rules, HiLo TC of 4 about 2 deck into shoe and I had a $100 bet, received 8,8 against a 10. I split (is that a mistake?), received a 7 and a 9 (busted), received another 8 and split again. First got a 10 (18), then another 8 (split again). First 8 got a 3, doubled (for less, $50) and got a 7 and the last 8, I received a 10. Dealer had a 10 for a 20. Lost $450.

    Anyone had this (4 8's) before?

    Was splitting the first or second or 3rd time a mistake? Should one split at TC 4? I know doubling for less was a mistake. The whole damn table was pitying me. A few, including dealer said they would not split against a 10.

    What mistakes was I making? Do you split it large bet is out and count is positive?

  2. #2
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    I would have surrendered. You probably played it right from an EV maximizing approach. But there are other approaches that maximize things like SCORE and CE. I tend to not split 8,8vT with a decent bet out there but that is not the EV maximizing way to play it. I just don't see the need to introduce the huge swings that happen when you split to 4 hands, which is not uncommon for the neutral 8 in any count. But most people don't do it the way I do. For the common criterion you played it right, assuming surrender wasn't an option for your first hand.

  3. #3


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    Notwithstanding the fact that you weren't betting enough, further assuming surrender was not available - you got unlucky.
    The first bust (879), index for standing hi lo is +4, pretty much a toss up. The double for less air stinks if ploppy ism.

    You really should discipline yourself. You should have bet more to begin with, not double for less and lost more - I would have. Now, change rather scenario around. Think about playing 2 hands, your super max bet out on the table, with a max split on hand 1, all doubled, and a simple double in hand 2.

    Think of all the money ?? On the table, think about winning. Winning is what happens when you do the proper things at the proper time. In order to win the title, we have to lose the occasional race.

  4. #4


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    3 and I have essentially, different answers. He is correct in saying that my answer is EV maximizing. His approach is also valid. What's right for any particular person is perspective.

    His approach is more risk averse. I take that approach in other areas. There is an index also for standing 88 v 10. Zee hadn't reached it.

  5. #5
    Senior Member BetWise21's Avatar
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    My two cents,

    IMG_0594.jpg

    I hate splitting 8,8 vs 10, if t could not surrender i'd rather stand in high counts and play it as a 16
    "between the conception and the reality, falls the shadow "

    Paraphrased: T.S. Eliot's
    The Hollow Men

  6. #6


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    Quote Originally Posted by Freightman View Post
    3 and I have essentially, different answers. He is correct in saying that my answer is EV maximizing. His approach is also valid. What's right for any particular person is perspective.

    His approach is more risk averse. I take that approach in other areas. There is an index also for standing 88 v 10. Zee hadn't reached it.
    Surrender was not an option. It was a $10 table and betting a $100 was a risk for heat given the pit was eyeing me suspiciously. So betting more was not really an option.

    I am hoping to develop a strategy for when to split and when to stand with an 8,8 hand against a 10. I have had success often when splitting, winning one losing the other and sometimes winning both. The doubling for less was more the result of defusing heat since pit was watching. The pit turned his back to hide the smirk when I lost all 4 hands but I was able to increase my bet to $150 with a steaming act. At the end of the 90 minute session, I managed to recover.

  7. #7


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    Quote Originally Posted by BetWise21 View Post
    My two cents,

    IMG_0594.jpg

    I hate splitting 8 vs 10
    Both 3 and I qualified our answers by saying - if surrender was not available. I hate splitting 88 v 10, but.....

  8. #8


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    Standing on 8-8 vs. 10 = +12 with Hi-Opt II
    so it has got to be about 1/2 of that for Hi-Lo

  9. #9


    1 out of 2 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    What are the chances the TC really was +4 after only 2 decks?

  10. #10


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    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeBabar View Post

    I am hoping to develop a strategy for when to split and when to stand with an 8,8 hand against a 10.
    Wow. You do not need software for this one. You play hi lo. Buy Wongs Professional Blackjack. Everything you need to know on this one, and much more, is in this book.

    Hi lo stand hit double split split after double tables start around page 252. Early late surrender tables are around page 92 (not in all printings).

    Oh, I'm at the coffee shop - some things are simply ingrained.

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