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Thread: A brief trip Las Vegas trip report and OSN

  1. #1


    0 out of 2 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No

    A brief trip Las Vegas trip report and OSN

    To begin with, I was notified and sent a copy of an OSN report with my picture and that of my car, licence plate etc. This was early in the month. I had mostly played with a players card (a big no, no on some forums) for over 3 years. I had mostly also played DD games (a counter trap according to some pros). I play HiLO with I-18 and a few other deviations (not really learned so maybe slightly inaccurate) based upon common sense. I had played about 3+ years part time and recreationally and had increased my BR from about $15k to my current $60k.

    In any case, with the OSN listing and forum views about what is likely to happen following an OSN listing, I considered cancelling my trip to Las Vegas (after all, it had only been a few weeks since I got put on OSN) but decided to test it out anyway. I decided to be anonymous and play anonymously during my 3 day trip.

    After I picked up my rental car midweek from the airport, I was thinking of just driving down to a motel or a lesser known casino and get a room for about $50 a night. As I sat adjusting my rental car mirrors and sync with my phone, I decided to just call one of the two big chains and see what they would say to my request for a comped room. I thought they would simply say no. The first major casino I called said that I was ineligible for a comped room but that they would give me a low casino rate (plus resort fee which would have cost more than the $50 a night). I thought maybe the OSN report has really screwed me up in their records. However, the next call to another casino of the same huge chain led to a 3 night comped room in a lovely 18th floor suite with a spectacular view of the mountains. I went to the casino hotel, used my players card and ID, got my room.

    Again, based upon forum reports, I was very nervous getting backed off so I started slowly at the Spaniard's place playing red chip DD game, soon as I was up a $100, I left. I wanted to eat Thai food across from the casino and had a great red curry dinner at the bar. I returned to pick up my car at the Spaniard's place and as I was passing the $25 SD, noticed it was empty and sat down. I refused a players card request (though I had a players card), the Asian lady and white elder gentleman in the pits played close attention so I started with a $50, went down to a $25 and up to a $100, played 2 shoes, went up $175, left for the garage and out and my casino/hotel. The casino hotel I was in at seemed to be having a small convention. Tables were packed. One pit had skimpy dressed dealers and 6/5 games with dealers taking turns dancing on a table in the middle of that pit. The tables were packed! I sat in the next pit for a while, played a bad DD game (no DAS, one pack cut off), stayed even and checked out the action for a while, went back up. It had been a long day (flight from the Midwest, time change and such) but I was up and that was good.

    Next morning I headed to the locals casino chain's property nearest to the strip. I refused a players card but the pit seem to recognize me (I had stayed and played there before), played their DD game for 30 minutes, up $140, left. I thought they were searching to find me on their computer so I left. Then I went to another far off local casino and played there. Still being Midweek, tables were available with just 1-2 players. Played anonymously but was nervous because of heat, the fact that I had played there rated on prior trips and with OSN, may get backed off. Lost a $1000 and was in the red. Drove down to another of the same chain's place, played anonymously and kept losing. Lost another $1100 while the pit guy kept making conversation, even suggesting I looked familiar and with me saying I dont remember playing there in a year or so (a lie), that if I looked familiar, he had an incredible memory. Now, I was deep in red (for me).

    Had a nice Vietnamese lunch, tried to review what was happening and felt I was so scared of the OSN and being backed off, I was playing cautiously, underbetting, doing cover plays like doubling for less (saying I choked, should have doubled for full amount etc.) and all the stuff about playing rated and OSN and such on these forums was affecting me. Decided I would go back and play more aggressively and see what happens.

    Went to another of the locals place, went down some $1700 dollars, decided after 90 minutes to see what will happen if I gave them my players card. Given I was losing, I was taking more $$ out and as the pit guy came to add it on the monitor by the table, I took a bunch of players card and asked if one of them was theirs. He said yes, took the card to a main computer in the middle of the pit and I thought, here it comes, the OSN and my back off. I was down almost $3k on the trip and thought I could care less and maybe its a good thing I get backed off. The trip's second day was a disaster. To my surprise, the pit guy returned to the table and gave me a higher level tier card saying he had upgraded me. I had a new different color card!!! I played on, a marathon session with the lack of scrutiny that comes with an established players card, recovered and won $600. Had played for about 3 hours! As I colored up, I said (if you comp me a meal, I would be back to play) and got comped a nice meal at their Chinese restaurant.

    From that point on, I played rated, played at the M properties, the CET properties and more locals casino over the next couple of days. All in all, I did 14 sessions over three days covering 17 actual table hours, ended up winning $1290. I was up over $2k but lost $900 in my last session before heading to return my rental car. Given my costs ($340 flight, $102 for resort fees, $127 for car rental, $92 for my car parked at local airport and $100 in meals), I ended up with just about $500 on the positive side.

    I still do not know what to make of the OSN listing (since it had no impact during my trip) or playing rated (my experience says that heat decreases palpably when you are a long term rated player and the free rooms and meal comps saved me at least $300).

    I dont know whether I can trust the advice of pros on forums on playing rated when they have not played rated in decades and dont know if being listed on OSN really effects small time players like myself. Maybe it effects those playing in HL rooms and black levels.

    I am just relieved that they were mostly wrong in their concerns about OSN effect, back offs and such. Its possible that my OSN listing has not yet circulated widely and thus no one was on the lookout for me. After all, its only been a few weeks.

    Oddly, I have even gone and played red chip short sessions at the casino (one of two locally) that likely listed me in OSN without any major consequences. I have also logged on to my account and received table play coupons. This week I am going to try and play the $25 tables to see if any counter measures take place.

    To newbies and the like, this forum provides good advice on all AP topics (counting, BR, etc.) except on playing rated and using players cards. I would still say that using a players card is not harmful and the small comps are still beneficial. Doing it as I did when I was starting out and having significant losing sessions (which I consider a cost of tuition) and making mistakes helps establish you as not being a polished AP and the benefits that can last a long time. Should they eventually catch on to you, I am not sure the OSN listing by a casino in your state will have an effect on your play in other states. Course, if your ultimate goal is t play high stakes BJ, its probably best you play those high stakes games as an anonymous player.

    As usual, some will vilify me for this post. It is what it is.

  2. #2


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    Make sure if you are playing different games that you have the BS for them down pat. For example in a NDAS game you are going to split less frequently. Also with single deck you still have to do true count conversions, so what you do is divide by the fraction of the deck remaining. For example if 1/4 of the deck is dealt then you divide by .75, so a running count of +3 would be a true count of +4.
    Last edited by Meistro123; 01-22-2018 at 10:19 AM.

  3. #3


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    OSN effects will snowball you in 6 to 12 months.

  4. #4


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    "For example in a DAS game you are going to split less frequently."

    You don't mean that.

    Don

  5. #5


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    True, I meant to say the opposite.

  6. #6


    3 out of 3 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    You really just don’t get it, Zee. Let me explain this in a way you might understand.

    Once the damage is done, it’s irreversible, unless you get a name change. Think about like this: you’re a guy with an A-1 credit score who just defaulted on his first loan payment. If you try to apply for more loans or credit cards right now, you probably won’t have any issues. After all, this one little hiccup on your credit score is too new and probably not enough to offset years of good credit history. But... If you make this a habit and continue to default on numerous other loans, then what do you think the consequences will be? Your credit score will eventually plummet and you will be viewed as a “high risk borrower.” This will prove to be very problematic in the future if you ever want to finance anything ever again, correct?

    This is how you should view your first entry into the database. Right now this is only one incident and you’ve yet to experience any of the long term set backs that will eventually (and inevitably) follow. But one of these days, you will be playing rated and some over-ambitious pit boss will scan your name into OSN; and when they find you in there, they will mark up your card and that player’s card will no longer be good with that chain. Keep it up and eventually your OSN entry will bleed over into Biometrica as well (assuming it already hasn’t). Then after that point, you’ll notice the database entries will start to become more and more frequent, assuming someone is nice enough to feed you that information still. Mark my words. This will eventually snowball. Enjoy your comps for now.

  7. #7


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    Edit ur post now that u received a copy of something. And who ever gave u a copy of something should of told u not to blab about it in a public forum.

  8. #8


    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Also stop sweating the databases. No one isngunna care if ur max bet is 2x200 and under u can play anywhere. River city is sweaty as fuck that's why u got updated.

  9. #9


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    Quote Originally Posted by smallcapgrowth View Post
    Also stop sweating the databases. No one isngunna care if ur max bet is 2x200 and under u can play anywhere. River city is sweaty as fuck that's why u got updated.
    Aah. I thought it was either it's sister property of the Hollywood place.

  10. #10


    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryemo View Post
    You really just don’t get it, Zee. Let me explain this in a way you might understand.
    You're going to need crayons.

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