See the top rated post in this thread. Click here

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 13 of 20

Thread: Hitting 12-16 against dealer's high cards at high TC...

  1. #1


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No

    Hitting 12-16 against dealer's high cards at high TC...

    It always has been frustrating when I get 12-16 at high TC against dealer's 7,8, etc (although the indices tell me to so do; I use Hi-Opt II + ASC). And it feels I always busted although the indices says to hit.

    It feels that I better just surrender and wait for next hand to fall in ten & ten. Anyone got comments on this? I always get stuck on 12-16 at high TC against the dealer's high card...I think this will be my last lesson to cope with this frustration.

  2. #2


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    It's frustrating getting dealt a bunch of sh** hands in a row with a high TC. But the math is the math. Unless they all messed up on calculating the proper strategy, you should keep hitting when the TC says to hit, stand when it says to stand, surrender when it says surrender, etc.
    "Everyone wants to be rich, but nobody wants to work for it." -Ryan Howard [The Office]

  3. #3
    Senior Member Bubbles's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    South West
    Posts
    957


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Surrender indexes exist that you can use. For instance, surrender 12v8 in single deck with hiopt2 at +36, 13v7 at +34, 13v10 at +11, 14v7 at +23, and 15 and 16v7 at +22. If you can't surrender, there are stand indexes too. Stand 16v7 at +16, 14v8 at +32, and 13 v 10 at +33.

    More indexes, and more accurate ones for the game you play, can be generated with CVData. There's still a lot of stiff hitting even if you learn many of these. At +15 TC, you'll still be best off hitting 16v7 for example.

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

  4. #4


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by Bubbles View Post
    At +15 TC, you'll still be best off hitting 16v7 for example.
    That is what I call cruel - you know you're gonna bust when the indices say to hit...

  5. #5


    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by Planisphere View Post
    It always has been frustrating when I get 12-16 at high TC against dealer's 7,8, etc (although the indices tell me to so do; I use Hi-Opt II + ASC). And it feels I always busted although the indices says to hit.

    It feels that I better just surrender and wait for next hand to fall in ten & ten. Anyone got comments on this? I always get stuck on 12-16 at high TC against the dealer's high card...I think this will be my last lesson to cope with this frustration.
    In order to be a successful Blackjack Player, you really must understand the concept of "Minimizing your losses" vs "Maximizing your Wins"..I believe most of us "counters" focus More on the Maximizing part of the game, way more than we do on the Minimizing part of the game..This includes going on tilt, superstition, mistakes and just all out "ripping at the seams" style of play...Been there, done that! More often than not, i usually lose around 25 MaxBets before i start winning it back(-.39)...Theres been countless times in previous years that ive literally let the psychological aspect of the game psyche me out and led me into believing that card counting just doesnt work..Even with Ho2 and good rules you WILL Exp. losing streaks last FOREVER from time to time..And i do mean FOREVER..It will feel s if your not even using a counting sytstem AT ALL..

    .So its importnt not to take this game for granted and understand just how big the Variance is in this game and that the Systems dont always work-just most of the time..Just duck for cover when the delers get hot, dont go on tilt, take a break when you feel yourself getting angry, play by the book and remember how Big the Variance is.. And Try just to Keep the Losses to the absolute Minimal and live to fight another day..Be Patient nd Keep Cool and the Cards will eventually come..
    Last edited by Jack Jackson; 01-02-2018 at 04:26 AM.
    http://bjstrat.net/cgi-bin/cdca.cgi

  6. #6


    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    The math is the math. Don't be a Zee.

  7. #7


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by Bubbles View Post
    Surrender indexes exist that you can use.
    At +15 TC, you'll still be best off hitting 16v7 for example.

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
    Plus 8 at halves us what I use

  8. #8


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by Planisphere View Post
    That is what I call cruel - you know you're gonna bust when the indices say to hit...
    It's likely that your just not suited for the game, given that you seem to agonize over most situations. The math is the math, the indices are the indices - they're there for a reason, and you don't know if you're going to bust when the index is to hit.

    Using the index is your best mathematical play, regardless of the hand being plus or minus EV, regardless of winning or losing the hand. Blackjack is a game of decisions. Making the best decisions is the route to making money.

    Provided you make the best decisions, you, as a player, want to maximize the number of decisions per hour that you make.

  9. #9


    0 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by moses View Post
    Quite often in pitch, it comes down to deck composition. Thus why I ask if he is referring to shoe or pitch. The OP is asking the best way to get out of a bad situation. The answer in DC avoids getting into that situation in the first place.
    Maybe so.
    Like Michael Corleone says - just when I thought I was out, they keep pulling me back in.
    https://youtu.be/UneS2Uwc6xw

    That's what index play is all about. Withdrawal, so to speak. To make the best out of a good situation as well as to make the best out of a bad situation.

    Sometimes you're in the drivers seat, other times not. When you're at the end of a shoe, composition characteristics, I would think, would match remaining deck characteristics of a pitch game.

    If you surrender everything when you're behind the 8 ball, you'll end up on shit creek without a paddle. Everyone seems to miss the artistic merit of a max bet index play coming to fruition, or simply winning more medals n bets in negative territory, or the bypass of indexes, when other information becomes available which trumps index play. I'm sure 3 and flash can give several examples if this - I know I can.

    Just do what you're supposed to do when you're supposed to do it, and everything comes to fruition. You won't win every session, but you'll be in the dough.

  10. #10


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by moses View Post
    An example. DD has only 8 of each Tag while the ten value has 32. Dealer has 11. Takes 3 dueces out of the deck to get to 17. However, only one 6 forces the dealer to stop at 17. Since they are given the same tag this could effect your TC one way or the other. Waiting one more hand may improve your position.
    Your point is very valid. I didn't elaborate beyond my comments, which are generically, quite solid. Advanced nuance play is beyond the scope of the thread, and I left it alone.

  11. #11


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by 21forme View Post
    The math is the math. Don't be a Zee.
    And I thought you were getting a handle on your Zee obsession. On average, about 90% of your posts mention Zee, even when he is not posting. Do see a therapist, please.

  12. #12


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeBabar View Post
    And I thought you were getting a handle on your Zee obsession. On average, about 90% of your posts mention Zee, even when he is not posting. Do see a therapist, please.
    You've again proven how wrong your math is. Mentioning you in the context I did was perfect, as you are the forums' poster child for a stupid, addicted gambler when it comes to BJ.

  13. #13
    Banned or Suspended
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Eastern U S A
    Posts
    6,830


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Planishere ...

    The majority of hands that you are dealt are "stiffs"

    You are suffering from chronic "selective memory" if

    you "feel" that your hands are worse than anyone else's.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. MJ: First Base: Better Chance of Catching High Cards?
    By MJ in forum Blackjack Beginners
    Replies: 19
    Last Post: 03-02-2005, 02:01 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

About Blackjack: The Forum

BJTF is an advantage player site based on the principles of comity. That is, civil and considerate behavior for the mutual benefit of all involved. The goal of advantage play is the legal extraction of funds from gaming establishments by gaining a mathematic advantage and developing the skills required to use that advantage. To maximize our success, it is important to understand that we are all on the same side. Personal conflicts simply get in the way of our goals.