See the top rated post in this thread. Click here

Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Halves Indexes Looking for Early Surrender Indexes

  1. #1


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No

    Halves Indexes Looking for Early Surrender Indexes

    Hi,
    I use mainly Hi Lo, but sometimes when i can only play in tables with some people and slow and hard schuffle, i can use double halves (tag=1,2,2,3,2,1,0,-1,-2,-2). I do this for avoiding boredom also.
    I have all indexes from grosjean's book (beyond counting) though i dont have early surrender for dealer's ace or ten.
    Also Grosjean doesnt give Risk Averses indexes so i am also interested for every indexes, not only surrender but surrender is more important.

    Anyone can help me ? ( To be fair i am thinking especially to the great and wonderful Gramazeka, BTW underestimated in this board from my modest point of view).

    I am also interested for full indexes for Revere Point Count ( Tag= 1,2,2,2,2,1,0,0,-2,-2) for full indices for early surrender and other decisions.
    Last edited by Norm; 12-15-2017 at 01:27 PM.

  2. #2


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenHouse View Post
    Hi,
    I use mainly Hi Lo, but sometimes when i can only play in tables with some people and slow and hard schuffle, i can use double halves (tag=1,2,2,3,2,1,0,-1,-2,-2). I do this for avoiding boredom also.
    I have all indexes from grosjean's book (beyond counting) though i dont have early surrender for dealer's ace or ten.
    Also Grosjean doesnt give Risk Averses indexes so i am also interested for every indexes, not only surrender but surrender is more important.

    Anyone can help me ? ( To be fair i am thinking especially to the great and wonderful Gramazeka, BTW underestimated in this board from my modest point of view).

    I am also interested for full indexes for Revere Point Count ( Tag= 1,2,2,2,2,1,0,0,-2,-2) for full indices for early surrender and other decisions.
    Wings Prifessional Blackjack hi lo, halves early and late surrender indexes
    Around page 90.

  3. #3


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Thank you freightman, this is a starting point.
    Nevertheless, Wongs uses a different system ( its simple halves with tags like 1.5 and 0.5 etc) so in approximation i should double these indices which should be not very precise. Also the book is a little bit old and didnt use modern computers, plus Wongs didnt uses calculation TC with flooring.
    So i am still interested in others sources of informations.

  4. #4


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenHouse View Post
    Thank you freightman, this is a starting point.
    Nevertheless, Wongs uses a different system ( its simple halves with tags like 1.5 and 0.5 etc) so in approximation i should double these indices which should be not very precise. Also the book is a little bit old and didnt use modern computers, plus Wongs didnt uses calculation TC with flooring.
    So i am still interested in others sources of informations.
    You've doubled the tags.
    Either divide by 2 to get the fractional count, or keep the doubled count and double the indexes.

    That being said, I use the actual fractions and have no issues. Further, the Wong indexes work perfectly fine, and your question suggests that you're likely, though not necessarily, fairly new.

    Your comments, though technically correct, will have little, if any difference. Newer players especially seem to think that it is crucial to be exact to the nth degree. This kind of thought process limits creative and artistic play, creating somewhat if a robotic approach. Do yourself a favour and try not to be a robot.

  5. #5


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    I read this forum since a lot of time also i havent participated, dont be misguided by my number of posts.

    I think i have a certain background of the AP world. I am sceptical about the utilisation of creative and artistic, for me an AP activity is more about using and choosing good methods, and finding the opportunities. Most AP players wont create anything. Straight count is a robot activity. Doing a robot activity doesnt mean you can not think outside the box when you leave the table .
    Also i understand the idea defended by your post, a AP should very have a fully background of all the aspects of the job. You have to do more than only having the good indexes and making no errors with Running Count.

    I agree that not having the "good" indices wont hurt you so much, but why give up some EV once you can have the good numbers ? Plus i think with surrender and especially early surrender, precise indexes can make a little bit of difference.

  6. #6


    2 out of 2 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    "You've doubled the tags.
    Either divide by 2 to get the fractional count, or keep the doubled count and double the indexes."

    How about calculating the TC by dividing by half decks, as is the case for the RPC. Double the Halves tags, divide by half decks, and leave the indices the same. :-)

    Don

  7. #7


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenHouse View Post
    I read this forum since a lot of time also i havent participated, dont be misguided by my number of posts.

    I think i have a certain background of the AP world. I am sceptical about the utilisation of creative and artistic, for me an AP activity is more about using and choosing good methods, and finding the opportunities. Most AP players wont create anything. Straight count is a robot activity. Doing a robot activity doesnt mean you can not think outside the box when you leave the table .
    Also i understand the idea defended by your post, a AP should very have a fully background of all the aspects of the job. You have to do more than only having the good indexes and making no errors with Running Count.

    I agree that not having the "good" indices wont hurt you so much, but why give up some EV once you can have the good numbers ? Plus i think with surrender and especially early surrender, precise indexes can make a little bit of difference.
    I've been quite successful with a casual fast and loose style, not worrying about calculating to the nth degree, adjusting on the fly, taking into account a number of variables such as deck pen by shoe, centred around a dual ramping system, making my deck estimation looking like shit. My developed creative and artistic abilities have served me well. As I've said before, I am consistent in my inconsistency.

    Nothing to be skeptical about. Calculating EV to the nth, trust me, gets noticed.

  8. #8


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by Freightman View Post
    I've been quite successful with a casual fast and loose style, not worrying about calculating to the nth degree, adjusting on the fly, taking into account a number of variables such as deck pen by shoe, centred around a dual ramping system, making my deck estimation looking like shit. My developed creative and artistic abilities have served me well. As I've said before, I am consistent in my inconsistency.

    Nothing to be skeptical about. Calculating EV to the nth, trust me, gets noticed.
    Further, interestingly enough and on a serious note, WHEATHER purposely or not, I've noticed, given identical play conditions, a general difference in spread between stores fairly close by (with a low expense factor) versus stores requiring flight and car rental (higher expense factor), the latter attracting the higher spreads.

    For those that travel, does this coincide with your experience.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Gramazeka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Ukraine
    Posts
    1,438


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenHouse View Post
    Anyone can help me ?
    index halves.jpgindex 2.jpg
    Last edited by Gramazeka; 12-17-2017 at 02:38 AM.

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    3rd rock from Sol, Milky Way Galaxy
    Posts
    14,158


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    I doubt he can read that chicken scratch. Perhaps an explanation that translates into English would make the post helpful.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Gramazeka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Ukraine
    Posts
    1,438


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by Three View Post
    I doubt he can read that chicken scratch. Perhaps an explanation that translates into English would make the post helpful.
    If you remove all the letters in the picture, then the information placed there is clear even for idiots.
    "Don't Cast Your Pearls Before Swine" (Jesus)

  12. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    3rd rock from Sol, Milky Way Galaxy
    Posts
    14,158


    Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by Gramazeka View Post
    If you remove all the letters in the picture, then the information placed there is clear even for idiots.
    I was talking about the 5,5 information.

Similar Threads

  1. Surrender Indexes
    By Bigdaddy in forum Software
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 07-12-2016, 04:37 PM
  2. Mark: Surrender Indexes
    By Mark in forum Blackjack Main
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 04-11-2003, 08:26 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

About Blackjack: The Forum

BJTF is an advantage player site based on the principles of comity. That is, civil and considerate behavior for the mutual benefit of all involved. The goal of advantage play is the legal extraction of funds from gaming establishments by gaining a mathematic advantage and developing the skills required to use that advantage. To maximize our success, it is important to understand that we are all on the same side. Personal conflicts simply get in the way of our goals.