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Thread: T count simulation

  1. #183


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    A comparison can be made with any system. We chose HiOpt II with full indices. If you or someone else can provide a precise definition of the ace side count adjustments that you use for HiOpt II playing decisions, then we can make that comparison as well.

  2. #184


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    Quote Originally Posted by Gronbog View Post
    A comparison can be made with any system. We chose HiOpt II with full indices. If you or someone else can provide a precise definition of the ace side count adjustments that you use for HiOpt II playing decisions, then we can make that comparison as well.
    ZenMasterFlash always provided the precise ace side count adjustment parameters for HiOptII in his posts when the topic came up. Shouldn't you just ask ZMF?
    Last edited by BJGenius007; 12-10-2017 at 11:40 AM.

  3. #185
    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    I think he was just making a comparison with a very good strategy, not specifically attempting to make a comparison with the one that one specific player plays.
    "I don't think outside the box; I think of what I can do with the box." - Henri Matisse

  4. #186


    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Quote Originally Posted by Gronbog View Post
    The 6 deck results above were with late surrender. Tarzan also left out the column headers and a bit of explanation. Let me try to clarify.


    • The Previous SCORE was from sims run by me in Feb/March of this year. Since then adjustments were made to the system and the Expert+KC (Expert + Key Cards) level was implemented.
    • The Latest SCORE was from sims re-run over the past few weeks
    • You can see that the Tarzan system SCOREs all improved due to the adjustments
    • The CVData+CVCX sims were not re-run
    • The HiOpt II sims were run with full indices as defined by CVData


    Sims for more rule sets and conditions are still underway.

    Code:
    6 decks 5/6 S17 DAS SP3 LS
    --------------------------------------------
                                                             Previous   Latest
    Scenario        System                  Source           SCORE      SCORE
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Play-All 1-8    Tarzan Basic            Gronbog          43.70      44.15
                    HiOpt II noASC          Gronbog          48.36      48.18
                    HiOpt II noASC          CVData+CVCX      48.36      48.36
                    HiOpt II                BJA3 Table 9.21  48.50      48.50
                    Tarzan Expert           Gronbog          50.92      51.42
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.10   Gronbog            -        52.11
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.11   Gronbog            -        52.27
                    HiOpt II + ASC          Gronbog          52.59      52.47
                    HiOpt II + ASC          CVData+CVCX      53.21      53.21
    
    Play-All 1-10   Tarzan Basic            Gronbog          50.38      50.85
                    HiOpt II noASC          Gronbog          55.10      54.86
                    HiOpt II noASC          CVData+CVCX      55.08      55.08
                    HiOpt II                BJA3 Table 9.21  55.96      55.96
                    Tarzan Expert           Gronbog          58.49      59.01
                    HiOpt II + ASC          Gronbog          59.76      59.63
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.10   Gronbog            -        59.74
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.11   Gronbog            -        59.92
                    HiOpt II + ASC          CVData+CVCX      60.53      60.53
    
    Play-All 1-12   Tarzan Basic            Gronbog          55.39      55.88
                    HiOpt II noASC          Gronbog          60.12      59.86
                    HiOpt II noASC          CVData+CVCX      60.07      60.07
                    HiOpt II                BJA3 Table 9.21  61.61      61.61
                    Tarzan Expert           Gronbog          64.19      64.71
                    HiOpt II + ASC          Gronbog          65.07      64.94
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.10   Gronbog            -        65.46
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.11   Gronbog            -        65.66
                    HiOpt II + ASC          CVData+CVCX      65.96      65.96
    
    Back-Count 1-1  Tarzan Basic            Gronbog          67.55      68.10
                    HiOpt II noASC          Gronbog          70.41      70.19
                    HiOpt II noASC          CVData+CVCX      70.22      70.22
                    HiOpt II + ASC          Gronbog          75.53      75.42
                    HiOpt II                BJA3 Table 9.21  76.00      76.00
                    HiOpt II + ASC          CVData+CVCX      76.68      76.68
                    Tarzan Expert           Gronbog          77.75      78.14
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.10   Gronbog            -        78.75
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.11   Gronbog            -        79.02
    
    Back-Count 1-2  Tarzan Basic            Gronbog          81.08      81.62
                    HiOpt II noASC          Gronbog          84.51      84.20
                    HiOpt II noASC          CVData+CVCX      84.28      84.28
                    HiOpt II                BJA3 Table 9.21  89.65      89.65
                    HiOpt II + ASC          Gronbog          90.96      90.82
                    HiOpt II + ASC          CVData+CVCX      92.44      92.44
                    Tarzan Expert           Gronbog          92.66      93.14
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.10   Gronbog            -        93.99
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.11   Gronbog            -        94.25
    
    Back-Count 1-4  Tarzan Basic            Gronbog          88.62      89.22
                    HiOpt II noASC          Gronbog          91.75      91.41
                    HiOpt II noASC          CVData+CVCX      91.53      91.53
                    HiOpt II                BJA3 Table 9.21  97.03      97.03
                    HiOpt II + ASC          Gronbog          98.89      98.80
                    HiOpt II + ASC          CVData+CVCX     100.60     100.60
                    Tarzan Expert           Gronbog         101.64     102.00
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.10   Gronbog            -       102.74
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.11   Gronbog            -       103.11
    
    Back-Count 1-8  Tarzan Basic            Gronbog          90.53      91.68
                    HiOpt II noASC          Gronbog          94.86      94.54
                    HiOpt II noASC          CVData+CVCX      94.57      94.57
                    HiOpt II + ASC          Gronbog         102.18     102.08
                    HiOpt II                BJA3 Table 9.21 102.45     102.45
                    HiOpt II + ASC          CVData+CVCX     103.94     103.94
                    Tarzan Expert           Gronbog         104.46     104.87
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.10   Gronbog            -       105.63
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.11   Gronbog            -       106.02
    
    Back-Count 1-12 Tarzan Basic            Gronbog          91.99      92.55
                    HiOpt II noASC          CVData+CVCX      94.43      94.43
                    HiOpt II noASC          Gronbog          95.63      95.31
                    HiOpt II + ASC          Gronbog         103.03     102.94
                    HiOpt II                BJA3 Table 9.21 102.97     102.97
                    HiOpt II + ASC          CVData+CVCX     104.94     104.94
                    Tarzan Expert           Gronbog         105.81     106.20
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.10   Gronbog            -       106.94
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.11   Gronbog            -       107.34
    
    Unrestricted    Tarzan Basic            Gronbog          92.80      93.35
                    HiOpt II noASC          Gronbog          96.00      95.67
                    HiOpt II noASC          CVData+CVCX      95.69      95.69
                    HiOpt II + ASC          Gronbog         103.34     103.25
                    HiOpt II + ASC          CVData+CVCX     105.29     105.29
                    Tarzan Expert           Gronbog         106.39     106.74
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.10   Gronbog            -       107.46
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.11   Gronbog            -       107.87
    
    2 decks 62/104 S17 DAS
    -------------------------------
                                                             Previous  Latest
    Scenario        System                  Source           SCORE     SCORE    Notes
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Play-All 1-4    HiOpt II                BJA3 Table 9.19  36.58      36.58   (I18 only)
                    HiOpt II noASC          CVData+CVCX      41.58      41.58
                    HiOpt II noASC          Gronbog          41.64      41.60
                    Basic Tarzan            Gronbog          43.98      45.23
                    HiOpt II + ASC          Gronbog          46.15      46.05
                    HiOpt II + ASC          CVData+CVCX      46.46      46.46
                    Tarzan Expert           Gronbog          47.63      48.89
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.10   Gronbog            -        49.91
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.11   Gronbog            -        50.01
    
    
    Play-All 1-6    HiOpt II                BJA3 Table 9.19  53.19      53.19   (I18 only)
                    HiOpt II noASC          CVData+CVCX      57.09      57.09
                    HiOpt II noASC          Gronbog          57.17      57.10
                    Basic Tarzan            Gronbog          59.96      61.30
                    HiOpt II + ASC          Gronbog          63.21      63.09
                    HiOpt II + ASC          CVData+CVCX      63.78      63.78
                    Tarzan Expert           Gronbog          64.95      66.33
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.10   Gronbog            -        67.60
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.11   Gronbog            -        67.69
    
    Play-All 1-8    HiOpt II                BJA3 Table 9.19  63.63      63.63   (I18 only)
                    HiOpt II noASC          Gronbog          66.72      66.62
                    HiOpt II noASC          CVData+CVCX      66.65      66.65
                    Basic Tarzan            Gronbog          69.81      71.17
                    HiOpt II + ASC          Gronbog          73.70      73.57
                    HiOpt II + ASC          CVData+CVCX      74.45      74.45
                    Tarzan Expert           Gronbog          75.58      76.98
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.10   Gronbog            -        78.38
                    Tarzan Expert+KC=0.11   Gronbog            -        78.46
    After looking at the results for the Tarzan count I concluded that Don Schlesinger is right. With infinite effort the Tarzan count barely outperforms Hi-OPT II with ASC.

  5. #187


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    Quote Originally Posted by Norm View Post
    I think he was just making a comparison with a very good strategy, not specifically attempting to make a comparison with the one that one specific player plays.
    Exactly.

  6. #188


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    Quote Originally Posted by BJGenius007 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Gronbog
    A comparison can be made with any system. We chose HiOpt II with full indices. If you [edit: meaning Flash] or someone else can provide a precise definition of the ace side count adjustments that you use for HiOpt II playing decisions, then we can make that comparison as well.

    ZenMasterFlash always provided the precise ace side count adjustment parameters for HiOptII in his posts when the topic came out. Shouldn't you just ask ZMF?
    That's what I did. We've seen snippets of this information posted here and there, but I'm not going to go searching the site looking for it. It would be easier to have the complete information (re)posted or sent to me all in one batch.

  7. #189
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    My Ace Side Count playing adjustments will be
    sent
    to gronbog in about 5 minutes.

    The adjustments that I have used for years are
    not quite perfect as I computed them long ago
    using Peter Griffin's matrix - but those figures
    were limited to one card draws.

  8. #190
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    Done.
    Back to the N.F.L.
    It is Sunday after all.

  9. #191


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    Folks here should be aware that I will be completing all the simulations requested by Tarzan before looking at ZMF's strategy.

  10. #192


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    Quote Originally Posted by seriousplayer View Post
    How far is the Tarzan Expert from perfect computer play?
    This is a question I would be curious to see answered as well. Unfortunately the only games where analysis is feasible are SPL1 (no resplits), unless there is new capability that I'm not aware of?

    Gronbog, let me know if it would be useful/helpful to run optimal play analysis for any rule variants, with the only constraint being that I can only compute necessary variances for SPL1.

  11. #193


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    Gronburg, You sure dedicate a lot of energy to BJ and this site. Thanks for that. What is your background, how did you get into all of this?

  12. #194
    Senior Member Bubbles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gronbog View Post
    Folks here should be aware that I will be completing all the simulations requested by Tarzan before looking at ZMF's strategy.
    I'm looking forward to your sims with the adjustments from the A and 7 from ZMF when you get to it. I like using the parameter adjustments, but have not figured out how to sim them.

  13. #195


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    Quote Originally Posted by SpikeBJ View Post
    Gronburg, You sure dedicate a lot of energy to BJ and this site. Thanks for that. What is your background, how did you get into all of this?
    I have been a professional software engineer for 36 years, splitting my career between 2 major software companies. I have a bachelor's degree in math with my major being computer science and a minor in combinatorics and optimization. This all happened before I had even the slightest interest in casino games. When I did become interested, I decided to write my own software in order to help me distinguish the fact from the fiction in what I was reading. That was 23 years ago. The software has evolved to suit my interests ever since then.

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