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Thread: Tolerance level advice needed for local casinos..

  1. #1


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    Tolerance level advice needed for local casinos..

    This is for the non Las Vegas, non heavy traveling, 1-3 casino town AP's. If you are going to play locally, if they are going to know you, if you get a players card, what might be the tolerance level of the casinos, that is, what strategies would you use to keep being welcomed.

    Is it going to be cumulative wins and you are going to lose the casinos once you have extracted a set sum? Is it going yo be because you have a series of wins or are a consistent winner regardless of the amount of your wins (say $100 -$200 a session, 3-4 sessions a week).

    If you plan to play 3-4 times a week and your goal is $800 a week, you have 2 stores in your area, what strategy would you use to maintain your playability in those local casinos where being anonymous is impossible? Has anyone done this sort of thing!

  2. #2


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    If you put a lot of time into just 2 casinos, you are not going to stay under the radar. You need to spread the action around more casinos than that to stay under the radar. Don't be lazy, drive out to wherever the other casinos are.

  3. #3


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    Zee,

    In that situation you need to spread across shifts/days of week as well as casinos. Your first level of cover comes from betting and staying out of the PB's radar. Well designed, obscure betting patterns will help keep the PB form referring you to surveillance. Look to Dr. Richard Reid ebook Dynamic Blackjack for betting with alternate bankrolls for ideas of where to start. You can get the money bet without a stair step "red flag" betting system.

    Using the local casino so they will know you as a reason to play rated does not hold water. Yes, they are going to know you but they don't have a regulated procedure for tracking your play like they do if you have a card. And I understand that once you get a card, you can't un-ring the bell. If you now try to stop giving them a card, they will record your play on your card anyway from their memory of your name.

    Cumulative winning is a store based issue and will bite you at some point. That point may well be a review of your players card activity which is certainly occurring monthly for marketing reasons (another reason not to use the damn things). I suggest they have a monthly report of cumulative winners and at certain thresholds they refer them to surveillance who review your play. Then you are likely toast. Even if they know you, you can take away their "ease of tracking".

    BTW, what difference does it make what their cumulative win threshold is? Are you going to stop winning when near it? I would speculate that you might be able to stop playing until they recycle the players card points/tracking (most reissue new cards annually at some as of date). Having the real information would be helpful but good luck with that, unless you have insider information.
    Luck is nothing more than probability taken personally!

  4. #4


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    Quote Originally Posted by moses View Post
    Your maximum goal should be equal to or slightly less than their minimum tolerance. If their minimum does render a decent profit, then why are you playing?

    Zee. Ive been rotating 5 casinos that provide a fair game for 7 years now and only lost one. Before that, it was exasperating. There is so much to go into. But with all due respect, you are not going to get it. Zee can't help Zee until Zee commits to help himself. You are not finding the answers here. You are only confusing the eye to confound your understanding. Why?
    Moses, I cannot undo the players card I used for a few years, also happen to have a friendly developed relationship with Pit and dealers. In early newbie years where I was working full time (pre-retirement), had family concerns and excuses, I played with a card, going up and down, at best staying even, making plenty of mistakes, betting less than optimally and no action was taken, I have been allowed to play with little to no scrutiny.

    Now, retired, with more study and practice, CVCX and optimal betting, for the past year, I have won consistently. I just do not know what to do since I don't even have to present a card, they know me. I have stared playing shorter sessions, walking away regularly with small wins, $200-$700. My sessions record in these 3 casinos is 17-4 over the past 3-4 months. Still no scrutiny that I can discern. I am trying to figure out a way to avoid the axe to fall.

    Is there a way to avoid the axe? In the particular state, they cannot ban you but so far only once did they reduce penn to 50% and I think it was a dealer decision because it went away with the dealer. Smaller wins and losses or any other strategy?

  5. #5


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    Quote Originally Posted by moses View Post
    What constitutes a session for you? 17-4 is impressive. How many casinos and DD games are in your rotation?

    A frequent player in the same rotation of casinos might as well accept a players card and enjoy the benefits. When I played only to win, i was beginning to think my name was Heyu Urgone anyhow.
    5,casinos, 2 in MS, 3 in MO, playing 85% DD games. A session as I recorded is actually a record for the day. Frankly, sometimes, they lasted 3-4 hours (like going down $1800, recovering to a small win or small loss) and sometimes, getting a quick $3-800 win and going home. Reason it's 17-4 is because I was not feeling heat, kept playing till I was ahead often.

    Now, I am moving to a city with perhaps 3 playable casinos where I am rated and want to limit travel, extract $800 a week from those 3 casinos. I would still travel once a month for 2-4 days. The question is how long and what strategies (besides rat holing) to use to keep from getting booted or measures taken while playing rated (since it's too late to undo it).

  6. #6


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    Thanks, Moses.

  7. #7


    0 out of 1 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Good points. From here on out, I will limit a session to an hour. This would bring me closer to a 60:40 win ratio, book more losses. Once I move there, I can vary the shifts I play at each casino, maybe 3 visits a week on three different shifts.

    Also explore Iowa, Illinois and a Indiana casinos. Never played in Iowa.

  8. #8


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    Quote Originally Posted by moses View Post
    If you go down $1,500 and then bounce back to even,
    you mind says you're even. They think of it as you got
    back $1,500 of their money.
    It was not long ago when the infamous Counter Catcher,
    Ritchie, backed me off after watching me recover $2,500
    in losses, without ever betting more than double the table
    minimum at a $25 table. Think of it this way ~ How often
    does a Ploppy recover thousands in losses in under two
    hours?
    This year, I was barred (and O.S.N. updated) after three
    days of sharp play and an unimaginably polite bet spread,
    that certainly was viewed as strategically "worse than
    break even." I was toking $50 to $150 per day. This goes
    to show that skilful play will not be tolerated. In my case
    I had won > $5,000 in the preceding three days, in a
    medium-sized casino with monthly gambling revenue of
    approximately $15,000,000.

  9. #9


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    Quote Originally Posted by moses View Post
    If you go down $1,500 and then bounce back to even,
    you mind says you're even. They think of it as you got
    back $1,500 of their money.
    It was not long ago when the infamous Counter Catcher,
    Ritchie, backed me off after watching me recover $2,500
    in losses, without ever betting more than double the table
    minimum at a $25 table. Think of it this way ~ How often
    does a Ploppy recover thousands in losses in under two
    hours?
    This year, I was barred (and O.S.N. updated) after three
    days of sharp play and an unimaginably polite bet spread,
    that certainly was viewed as strategically "worse than
    break even." I was toking $50 to $150 per day. This goes
    to show that skilful play will not be tolerated. In my case
    I had won > $5,000 in the preceding three days, in a
    medium-sized casino with monthly gambling revenue of
    approximately $15,000,000.

  10. #10


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    I suppose in regular local casinos, it might be a good idea to have a session stop when winning $200 or playing 45 minutes, whichever comes first. I noticed that they often, when busy, do not bother to note when a player walks away. Sometimes, I have abruptly gotten up, did not color up, flashed chips in my hand, told the dealer I was up $100, be back soon and left. At one casino, my records showed I had won $1800+ the past year but their won loss record showed me as having lost $4500+.

    Is it a good idea to check won/loss record often?

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