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Thread: Do any of you bother with tournaments

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    Do any of you bother with tournaments

    I play a tournament ever once in a while, especially if it's free entry. I've played enough to know that blackjack skills don't come into play much. The winners just get lucky at the right time. I read Wong's book about tournament play but so far it hasn't helped much. The first tournament I entered years ago in Vegas was a $25 entry and I came in 2nd place and won around $600. Since then nothing.

    I wondered if any of you APs bother with tournaments.

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    Last tournament I was in, I hit an A7 against a ten. Drew another ten so I was happy, but no one else hit and the dealer pulled an 8 to make 21 and bust the entire table. It was the last hand and everybody was all in so we all ended up with zero for the round.
    A good ole boy took violent exception to my move and ended up being taken out , hogtied, by the Laughlin PD.
    You can have fun even if you lose.
    Have you read Wiggys story on how to cheat in a tournament
    Let me die in my sleep like my Grandfather.
    Not screaming in agony like his passengers.

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    No, I haven't read Wiggy's story. Link?

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    Senior Member Frostbyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom View Post
    No, I haven't read Wiggy's story. Link?
    It's in his new book, 1536 Free Waters.
    "Wait a minute. How do you beat someone to death with their own skull? That doesn't seem physically possible." "That's what Jimmy kept screaming: 'This doesn't seem physically possible!'"

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    LOL..

    I play them when they are free if I am already in town.. I like to talk pretend smack to the other players and make stupid justified plays. The last one I was in had a HUGE prize pool and I was one huge DD away from getting to the final table and a crack at the $$. I had an 11 v 10.. Doubled my already MAX bet with almost all my remaining chips, drew a crappy card but the dealer flipped a six in the hole, only to draw an ace.. Haha. Fun still..

    When you get down to the $$, advanced play really does come into play, such as setting a surrender trap etc..

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    Tournaments have been more lucrative for me than "regular" play but that's because back when I started playing tourneys, there weren't many savvy tournament players. That has changed greatly. The big purse events (25k and up) attract several strategy wise regulars now (gronbog is among the best) and it has become more difficult to "cash" with the much improved competition present. I try to talk gronbog into staying home!
    Last edited by muffdiver; 01-24-2013 at 06:34 AM.

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    I have had fun in 8 BJ tourneys and made the final table twice. First out once and third out another. I was first out a session in the entire tourney twice as I bought in for a second chance. The tourney was in a room where the 1st to lose was well noticed by all and I did it twice.The second time I asked the dealer if I could sit there for a few minutes so I wasn't the first to leave again. I did. but I was still the first. I talked myself into "no big deal" attitude, embraced the loss and me and my fresh Corona stopped at a BJ table and won 700 and then hit a royal at a dollar VP max bet. I was now on STRUT mode.

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    Senior Member yesiamred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom View Post
    I play a tournament ever once in a while, especially if it's free entry. I've played enough to know that blackjack skills don't come into play much. The winners just get lucky at the right time. I read Wong's book about tournament play but so far it hasn't helped much. The first tournament I entered years ago in Vegas was a $25 entry and I came in 2nd place and won around $600. Since then nothing.

    I wondered if any of you APs bother with tournaments.
    Yes, only last year where I played 5 times and I won 3 out of the 5 tourneys then they discontinued them. I hope to in the future get involved with more tournaments...it's fun and strategic

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    Quote Originally Posted by muffdiver View Post
    Tournaments have been more lucrative for me than "regular" play but that's because back when I started playing tourneys, there weren't many savvy tournament players. That has changed greatly. The big purse events (25k and up) attract several strategy wise regulars now (gronbog is among the best) and it has become more difficult to "cash" with the much improved competition present. I try to talk gronbog into staying home!
    Thanks, muffdiver, for your kind words. Especially gratifying coming from a tournament player of your calibre. Heads up -- I will be attending at least one of the Kewadin tournaments this summer

    As someone who plays recreationally, I can also say that I've profited much more from tournament play than anything else. I started with blackjack tourneys but now also play baccarat and roulette tournaments. Each has its opportunities for strategic play, some shared and some unique. The advantage comes from playing against fields of ploppies who, mostly, play with no strategy at all allthough, as muffdiver has said, the general skill level at blackjack tournaments, especially those which are held regularly has improved a lot in recent years.

    Quote Originally Posted by phantom View Post
    I play a tournament ever once in a while, especially if it's free entry. I've played enough to know that blackjack skills don't come into play much. The winners just get lucky at the right time. I read Wong's book about tournament play but so far it hasn't helped much.
    I would disagree with your statement which implies that it's mainly luck.I will concede that there is a significant luck factor, but as with all advantage play, all you need is a small edge combined with repetition to make it profitable. There are certainly times when skill at blackjack comes into play, especially when knowing when (and why) to deviate from basic strategy but, by far, the main skill is in betting strategy. This is the focus of Wong's book and many of the principles apply to other games. By leveraging or opposing the co-variance among the results of players at the same table, as appropriate, a skilled played can gain a large advantage. This is particularly important in the final few hands where a strategic bet coupled with strategic play can improve your chance of advancing by many percentage points over uninformed bet+play.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tthree View Post
    I have played in some. Unfortunately the ones lately have been BJ tournaments where you play against the field in the early round(s) of the tournament. Not much luck in them.
    The skill in these is to determine the likely advancing threshold through a combination of statistical analysis, experience and espionage. Once you've determined your goal, the optimal strategy turns out to be to bet max until you make it or bust out. Variance is your friend and you want to leverage it. While not mentally challenging, this strategy is hugely successful against most fields of players who tend to play too conservatively to even have a shot at making it. Once you get good at setting the goal, your rate of advancement at these kinds of tournaments can exceed that of the table-elimination format.

    As has been mentioned, it's easy for most ful time APs to get comped into many tournaments simply through volume of play or even the promise of a given amount theoretical play. When comped, it is certainly an advantage situation and a fun way to play your favourite game a little differently. I don't play enough to get comped into most of the tourneys that I play and have still managed a substantial profit over the years.

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    Tournaments can be very time demanding.
    May have something better to do

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    I guess the reason I think it's a lot of luck is because I've played at the table with the winners after the tournament. Recently I played with a woman that came in 3rd and she was hitting 12 against a 6 and other similar moves. She was playing her tournament chips winnings. When she did one stupid play the dealer said, "You know you're not in a tournament any more."

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    The saying "I'd rather be lucky than good" is many times heard at tournaments. There's no denying that luck is a HUGE factor but as gronbog states, it's well worth it to know what you're doing. Sure, the correct play backfires sometimes but you have to look for long term results.

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    Good point. As I like to look at it, everyone will have the same amount of luck over time, both good and bad. That same amount of luck plus skill = an advantage. The amount of advantage provided by skill varies depending on the game, but even in games with no player skill involved (e.g. baccarat, roulette), the right betting strategy is what provides that advantage.

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