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Thread: Regarding playing rated...

  1. #1


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    Regarding playing rated...

    Could one property see how you did at another property?

    Does cumulative wins apply to each casino or does cumulative wins in all casinos add up and could lead to a barring from all properties of that chain?

  2. #2


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    IMHO, for the advantage player, the value from "free" shit provided by casinos is far offset by the ongoing cost of being flyered, backed off and trespassed.

    In response to your question, it depends on the chain. I believe you will find Harrah's to have two computer systems that talk to each other but we are not sure are what level of detail. First is their operational system whose focus is to manage a property and its games. That system then feeds "relevant" information to a marketing system that decides what level of sucker you are and conjures up offers to entice you even more.

    Harrahs marketing system is company wide and is by far the most sophisticated with MGM likely next and then some outliers like Barona. Unfortunately, the only way to confirm these thought are to get access to a confederate or experience it yourself. Even experiencing it will likely leave you guessing as to the cause.

    Stations properties have access to each others surveillance data and likely play data for marketing. Many of their "offers" are good at multiple stores in their group. These statements are not speculation, but a fact that I have confirmed.

    My advice is to protect your identify like it is a large stack of $5K chips! If your game needs the comps and you give up your identify, then you are in trouble, long term.
    Luck is nothing more than probability taken personally!

  3. #3


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    Quote Originally Posted by Stealth View Post
    IMHO, for the advantage player, the value from "free" shit provided by casinos is far offset by the ongoing cost of being flyered, backed off and trespassed.

    In response to your question, it depends on the chain. I believe you will find Harrah's to have two computer systems that talk to each other but we are not sure are what level of detail. First is their operational system whose focus is to manage a property and its games. That system then feeds "relevant" information to a marketing system that decides what level of sucker you are and conjures up offers to entice you even more.

    Harrahs marketing system is company wide and is by far the most sophisticated with MGM likely next and then some outliers like Barona. Unfortunately, the only way to confirm these thought are to get access to a confederate or experience it yourself. Even experiencing it will likely leave you guessing as to the cause.

    Stations properties have access to each others surveillance data and likely play data for marketing. Many of their "offers" are good at multiple stores in their group. These statements are not speculation, but a fact that I have confirmed.

    My advice is to protect your identify like it is a large stack of $5K chips! If your game needs the comps and you give up your identify, then you are in trouble, long term.
    This excellent advice is initially rejected by many as non applicable to their situation, and thus, many of us, including myself, have somewhere paid some price for our short term gain.

    In a recent thread (annual hours), Ryemo and myself traded info on expenses. In my post 17, i heavily implied that I accept room comps only in Vegas. The clear message was that I would prefer the expense of rooms cars, flights etc VS the comps involving giving away to much information. Granted, one nearby drivable destination, though not having my info, at least from me, I'm essentially considered a local. I'm tracked under my first name or number or whatever they are doing these days.

    In a few weeks, I will be flying to another city with several venues. On my last trip, one of these venues had a host drooling over me wanting my name fir a card and future comps. I let them buy me dinner, but no personal information was disclosed. Obviously, I attracted attention. If they checked my resident locale, they would quickly find that the pleasure of my company is no longer welcomed. Secondly, with info, and a potential backoff, who knows where my picture and info would land.

    Regardless of the above, I foolishly ignored the common wisdom to a few Vegas spots, and I have no idea where my picture may have ended up - and I'm thinking if some low end games from years ago.

  4. #4


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    Quote Originally Posted by Freightman View Post
    This excellent advice is initially rejected by many as non applicable to their situation, and thus, many of us, including myself, have somewhere paid some price for our short term gain.

    In a recent thread (annual hours), Ryemo and myself traded info on expenses. In my post 17, i heavily implied that I accept room comps only in Vegas. The clear message was that I would prefer the expense of rooms cars, flights etc VS the comps involving giving away to much information. Granted, one nearby drivable destination, though not having my info, at least from me, I'm essentially considered a local. I'm tracked under my first name or number or whatever they are doing these days.
    I agree. I foolishly soiled my name a long time ago and wish I hadn't. If I knew then what I know now... sigh. A lot of my rated play now is on cards that I don't care to throw away... Unfortunately, I'll never be able take my real name out of the databases.

  5. #5


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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryemo View Post
    I agree. I foolishly soiled my name a long time ago and wish I hadn't. If I knew then what I know now... sigh. A lot of my rated play now is on cards that I don't care to throw away... Unfortunately, I'll never be able take my real name out of the databases.
    Everyone needs to develop stock answers countering the request to get a card. I won't give away mine, other than - your comps stink. You NEED to understand that some hosts are really aggressive about wanting your info. You NEED to be just as tough about "rejecting their advances".

    I recall one humorous situation - after a semi large cashout, as is my habit, go to the bathroom, enter an end stall and reorganize my money. The host, unsuccessful at getting my info at the table, was coincidentally by the mens washroom when I exited. She started where she left off. She didn't beat about the bush, though i got the distinct Impression that she wouldn't have minded me beating about hers. Think that was the old Hilton in Vegas.

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    I agree in general with the above statements. Yet, these statements need to take into account two issues. 1. The casino already has your photo, which is a big part of who you are. In fact, in the future that could be all they need to identify you. 2. If you refuse a card, it will only increase their efforts to identify you through other means possible.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeBabar View Post
    Could one property see how you did at another property?

    Does cumulative wins apply to each casino or does cumulative wins in all casinos add up and could lead to a barring from all properties of that chain?
    Yes, properties can dig in their system to see your result at all of their properties
    Most properties keep their own play data. Usually they see your Current Trip, last 90 days, your YTD results. You may have a comp bucket on your player card generated from all casinos, but discretionary comps are usually property specific.

    There is a reason many casinos clean house of players in the 1Q of each year.

  8. #8


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    Playing rated under my real name in LV even with heavy cover and camo was still the biggest mistake I've made thus far...

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    Well, to be more specific, I visited Las Vegas, stayed in a comped room for 2 nights, checked in, went down and in my first session, won about $600. Variance was with me and in the two nights, I kept going from one to another of the chain, handing in my players card and basically, won some 6-7 straight short sessions for about 12 hours of playing in the next 36 hours, l won over $3k.

    The thing is that I was half expecting that they could see I was jumping from one to another of their stores, had been winning and they would give me heat but it never happened. I am back home now and waiting to see if I will continue to receive offers.

  10. #10


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    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeBabar View Post
    Well, to be more specific, I visited Las Vegas, stayed in a comped room for 2 nights, checked in, went down and in my first session, won about $600. Variance was with me and in the two nights, I kept going from one to another of the chain, handing in my players card and basically, won some 6-7 straight short sessions for about 12 hours of playing in the next 36 hours, l won over $3k.

    The thing is that I was half expecting that they could see I was jumping from one to another of their stores, had been winning and they would give me heat but it never happened. I am back home now and waiting to see if I will continue to receive offers.
    Zee - you're playing with a snake. Best way to not get bit is to not play with a snake.

  11. #11


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    Playing rated is a damned if you do damned if you don't situation. I got burned from rated play a few weeks ago and determined that I need to play rated at more break even levels at some places for comps and unrated in others.

  12. #12


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    I do seem to have difficulty handling it when a pit person asks for my players card. If I simply say I don't have one and don't want one (I do have a players card from most of the major chains), I can sense more heat. If I hand over the players card, I am welcomed and there seems to be no heat, the meal comps are easy. I also worry that they may know I am lying when I say I don't have a card, don't want one, that they may know I had played with card before.

  13. #13


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    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeBabar View Post
    I do seem to have difficulty handling it when a pit person asks for my players card. If I simply say I don't have one and don't want one (I do have a players card from most of the major chains), I can sense more heat. If I hand over the players card, I am welcomed and there seems to be no heat, the meal comps are easy. I also worry that they may know I am lying when I say I don't have a card, don't want one, that they may know I had played with card before.
    Zee
    There's lots of ways for the pit to ask, and to annoy you in a different manner while they hound you to get a card.
    There's also lots of ways for you say - leave me the fuck alone, I'm not interested. Be creative.

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