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Thread: take advantage of casino cash with limited games

  1. #1
    Senior Member happyjack21's Avatar
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    Question take advantage of casino cash with limited games

    So I got an offer for 50 dollars for me and a friend if we show up at our regular casino.
    My problem is that the money is loaded on to your players card. You can't use it for baccarat, BJ, craps, or anything else with a tolerable H.E. Basically can't play any of the games I would consider.
    All I can play with the voucher are the slots, video poker, and the multi action machines that have computerized BJ (probably with dealer wins 17 ties and crappy rules)
    I don't know how to play video poker but I do have a book on the subject and understand poker on a basic level. Am I going to look like a total rube, or even kicked out, if I have the book in front of me during my session? That's what the book suggested but just wondering how you guys felt about that piece of advice.

    Thanks for any help!

    I'm just a little red-chipper so learning video poker for comps and + EV isn't exactly what I'm looking to do (at this time) Just wondered how you guys might play it if you were in my shoes.

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    Senior Member Tom's Avatar
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    I would:

    Walk over to $25 slot with max bet of 2 and pull (or $5 machine for a couple tries). Cash out. Go play Blackjack.

    That's what I would do because I don't play video poker and would just make random guesses if I tried. This worked when I got $5 for getting a rating card. Put into dollar machine max bet won like $20. Put that into $5 machine max bet and won $100. Left. The time being spent on VP could be used for Blackjack. Just something to keep in mind.
    Last edited by Tom; 02-01-2013 at 08:23 PM.
    ~Tom (aka "PT")

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  3. #3


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    You're not going to get too much from VP or other slots with a $50 voucher. I say do what Tom recommands, and throw it all on one roll...or spread it out over a few rolls. If you win -- sweet, free money! If you lose -- well it wasn't worth anything to begin with. If you do this and hit a juicy jackpot...you owe me & Tom 5% each.
    "Everyone wants to be rich, but nobody wants to work for it." -Ryan Howard [The Office]

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    Find out what pay schedules they have for the different video poker games noting the top paying for each game. The wizard has optimal strategy for these games on his sight. Print the cheat sheet and study it for the game you intend to play. Bring it when you play. Consult the sheet if necessary. Nobody will care but some people that are making mistakes might make fun of you. Just know they could benefit from doing the same.

    You can use two strategies depending on your personal risk profile but either one you are best to limit your play to as few pulls as possible. The idea is you want variance. The more spins you use the closer you expect to be to your theoretical loss or maybe even win if you find good enough machines. If you want to be more sure to walk with something play a 25 cent machine until you played through your $50 and cash out immediately. That will probably be 40 spins. If you want a chance a a big win play the $50 through in as few of spins as possible. You may walk with nothing playing it on 2 spins on a $5 machine but your chance of winning a lot are much higher.

    I once played through a free slot bonus on 5 spins. The third I got an up and down straight flush draw and missed but hit the straight but the fourth I got and inside straight flush draw and hit the straight flush for 250 coins. If I had played a lower denomination game the cash value of the coins would have been much less. I have won nothing a few times but most of the time you come in around your EV a plus or minus 50%. That rare time you pull a really nice hit on one spin you win a lot. The EV will be really close to the monetary value of the free slot play.

    Remember with this play and match plays you want variance. For match plays I prefer to get two or three MPs rather than one but much more than that is not as desirable for my game plan. One match is okay but if the denomination is very large I prefer two or three. It limits risk while still giving a nice shot at high reward. Free play is theoretically no risk but I have lost money on the play at times when I split and double. Just remember you split and double strategy is not the same. Defensive splits are not desirable because you have less to defend for double the cost. Doubles should be weighted differently also as you are tripling risk on MPs and infinitely increasing risk on free play for double the reward.
    Last edited by Three; 02-02-2013 at 07:52 AM.

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    If you play VP and make a reasonable guess at the strategy, you are probably playing with less house edge than slots, but either way, playing through $50 once should net you at least $45 in EV. I'd recommend going to vpfree2.com and finding out the best video poker offered at your casino, then find the strategy on Wizard of Odds and copy it onto a small piece of paper. Find the right machine (with the right pay table) and use the strategy while you play. It will only take a few minutes, even consulting the strategy. It's perfectly acceptable to use a strategy card when playing video poker. Everybody else around you will be so entranced by their machine that they won't even know you are there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tthree View Post
    Find out what pay schedules they have for the different video poker games noting the top paying for each game. The wizard has optimal strategy for these games on his sight. Print the cheat sheet and study it for the game you intend to play. Bring it when you play. Consult the sheet if necessary. Nobody will care but some people that are making mistakes might make fun of you. Just know they could benefit from doing the same.

    You can use two strategies depending on your personal risk profile but either one you are best to limit your play to as few pulls as possible. The idea is you want variance. The more spins you use the closer you expect to be to your theoretical loss or maybe even win if you find good enough machines. If you want to be more sure to walk with something play a 25 cent machine until you played through your $50 and cash out immediately. That will probably be 40 spins. If you want a chance a a big win play the $50 through in as few of spins as possible. You may walk with nothing playing it on 2 spins on a $5 machine but your chance of winning a lot are much higher.

    I once played through a free slot bonus on 5 spins. The third I got an up and down straight flush draw and missed but hit the straight but the fourth I got and inside straight flush draw and hit the straight flush for 250 coins. If I had played a lower denomination game the cash value of the coins would have been much less. I have won nothing a few times but most of the time you come in around your EV a plus or minus 50%. That rare time you pull a really nice hit on one spin you win a lot. The EV will be really close to the monetary value of the free slot play.

    Remember with this play and match plays you want variance. For match plays I prefer to get two or three MPs rather than one but much more than that is not as desirable for my game plan. One match is okay but if the denomination is very large I prefer two or three. It limits risk while still giving a nice shot at high reward. Free play is theoretically no risk but I have lost money on the play at times when I split and double. Just remember you split and double strategy is not the same. Defensive splits are not desirable because you have less to defend for double the cost. Doubles should be weighted differently also as you are tripling risk for double the reward.
    Variance is good for match plays, but this sounds like a freeplay. You don't want variance on freeplay. It's the same as if they said you had to bet $50 of your own money on something, then they will hand you $50 cash. With a $50 matchplay, it's like if you bet $100 of your own money, and if you lose, they rebate $50. Variance is good because it only helps you if you lose (on a win it is no different than if you had just bet $100 of your own money with no matchplay). For freeplay, I could say it is like betting $50 of your own money, then win or lose, they give you $50 in cash. This is not contingent on a loss, so variance is not desirable.

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    To me, $50 is not a desirable outcome for the free play. I want something so I usually don't play it through in 1 or 2 spins but at least 5. That is my preference to have a better shot at a payout that would be more meaningful. I mentioned he choose according to his style of risk and reward. If all you are worried about is every little once of EV you are right. If you want a shot at real money you go has few spins as possible. I prefer the middle ground. It has served me well. I don't turn down freebees but I also want them to be meaningful amounts without too big of a chance of 0 return.

    My worst outing I had a $100 bet I could make with a free ace coupon along with $80 in Match play that I took as 2 fifties and 3 tens. I lost $180 playing them. I won one $10 bet and lost both hands a sweet split for $10 plus coupon plus $20. I lost more with straight MP but with the free ace I saw this as a worse beating than the one for -$225 on $225 in match plays. You hardly ever lose those free ace coupons.

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    i'd play it through on video bj. typical video bj has a house edge circa 2.7 or so but not so bad of variance as video poker.
    some joints have electronic craps, that wouldn't be to bad betting the pass line, errhh what house edge?, 1.54, i think.

  9. #9


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    I've tried playing free play both ways and now tend towards the miserly approach of playing video BJ (for low variance and an almost guarantee of getting a good portion of the free play cash back) or VP games with lower volatility (i.e., pays 2 for 1 for two pair). Naturally, I cash out all of the winnings immediately. I've never hit a really good payout trying the volatile approach of playing a few large bets hoping for a win and always ended up disappointed.

    I guess that I finally started looking at these plays in the long run – since I have gotten them quite frequently over the years. I'd rather play for the lowest house edge and volatility that I can reasonably find. YMMV.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sagefr0g View Post
    some joints have electronic craps, that wouldn't be to bad betting the pass line, errhh what house edge?, 1.54, i think.
    I am pretty sure it's 1.41%. The place bet on 6 or 8 is about 1.54Z%

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    If you're gonna play craps like a bad@ss, throw it all on a "crap yo'leven". Still not exactly sure what that means, but people always do it, and sometimes they even win their crap yoleven!
    "Everyone wants to be rich, but nobody wants to work for it." -Ryan Howard [The Office]

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    Quote Originally Posted by RollingStoned View Post
    throw it all on a "crap yo'leven".
    House edge 15+%. I am pretty sure he is joking.
    Last edited by Three; 02-03-2013 at 11:43 AM.

  13. #13


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    Quote Originally Posted by Tthree View Post
    I am pretty sure it's 1.41%. The place bet on 6 or 8 is about 1.54Z%
    right, i don't know much about craps, swore off it cause for some reason i'm attracted to it like a moth to a flame, lol.
    so, i wonder if on the electronic craps table, if one could use free play money on both the pass line and don't pass both at the same time, sorta thing? like i say, i don't know about craps, but would that scenario get you a lot of your free play value back?
    or how about the electronic roulette table, say you bet red and black at the same time, then it would just be the percentage of times the 0 or 00 came up? not sure what percentage of times the 0 or 00 comes up?

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